Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline • Hacker News Board

Re: Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline

#141

Post by acuozzo » Mon, Mar 06, 2023, 8:53 PM UTC

forgetfulness wrote: post #134

orangepurple wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In the big chains it's overwhelming consolidation and cost cutting that completely eliminated flavor. Sugar and heat compensate for the lack of flavor. Finally, overweight and obese people perceive the things they eat differently than if their BMI was normal (personal experience going from obese class 1 to normal). If the majority of your clientele are obese or overweight, you will update the menu to appease their pa…

> Finally, overweight and obese people perceive the things they eat differently than if their BMI was normal Besides asking for studies that may or may not be there, what was your experience with this? I hadn't heard of this before.

> what was your experience with this?

Not OP, but I've lost >100 lb. three separate times in my life, so I suppose I qualify.

It affects you in ways that are analogous to overindulging in adult entertainment.

You need higher peaks (e.g. more salt) and, in my experience at least, you gradually lose the ability to pick out subtle flavors.

You start to prefer food that you can scale as you see fit. Lots of rice. Lots of potatoes. Lots of popcorn.

Re: Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline

#142

Post by places2be » Mon, Mar 06, 2023, 9:02 PM UTC

noyeastguy wrote: post #59

I follow a yeast-free diet to control an auto-immune disease called Hidradenitis suppurativa. Some doctors produced a study a while back where they found anti-Saccharomyces cerevisiae autoantibodies in HS patients. When patients followed a yeast and wheat-free diet they would see 100% remission of symptoms. The hardest part of following this diet is avoiding yeast as it is a major flavor component in almost all "ultr…

Have you found that it has helped your Hidradenitis suppurativa too?

Re: Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline

#143

Post by acuozzo » Mon, Mar 06, 2023, 9:02 PM UTC

jrsj wrote: post #138

eddsh1994 wrote: post #8

I like the whole food based diet; essentially buying fresh items simple ingredients. Stick to the meat and produce isles, maybe go to the butchers or bakery for local meat and bread, and a greengrocers for local veg. Make things like sauces from scratch. I enjoy cooking which helps. I believe that no matter what Scientists decide are good/bad for that particular year I'm going to be okay because it's simple, fresh, a…

A lack of knowledge about cooking is imo the single biggest cause of health issues in the United States. People generally know that real food is healthier, but it’s not convenient and they don’t know how to cook so it’s really not even an option most of the time.

> A lack of knowledge about cooking

Knowing how to cook doesn't solve the underlying problem driving someone to use food as a drug.

I had laid many pots of Boeuf Bourguinon on my family's dinner table before I started shoving Big Macs into my face every night when I hit rock bottom.

Re: Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline

#144

Post by acuozzo » Mon, Mar 06, 2023, 9:07 PM UTC

hombre_fatal wrote: post #18

colechristensen wrote: post #7

Oof, what exactly is "ultra processed food", because as far as I can tell it's "whatever seems bad". How much "processing" a potato chip gets (slice, fry, salt) is a whole lot different than one of the meat substitute burgers. It seems like anything done on an industrial scale is evil and anything done in your kitchen is fine, despite the two being very similar in many cases. Either there's a problem with specific in…

Well, they point out that "ultra processed" is a euphemism for hyperpalatable foods that are low in nutrients and high in calories. I don't think we need to parcel out the exact moment in processing where something becomes "ultra processed" since it's just a euphemism. It's like overly scrutinizing an analogy for contradiction instead of considering the point it's trying to make. An obvious mechanism would be nutrien…

> that are low in nutrients and high in calories

What exactly does this mean? The potential energy in food measured by calories is in its macronutrients. No macronutrients, no calories.

Is it some kind of reference to micronutrients, phytochemicals, and the like which are reduced by processing activities like blanching?

Re: Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline

#145

Post by kulahan » Mon, Mar 06, 2023, 9:07 PM UTC

thrwaway98423 wrote: post #13

Even though this is a review, it still suffers from the fact that diet studies are not controlled, randomized, or blind. My mother has early onset dementia. Her habits were very healthy for 30+ years (quit drinking, quit smoking, daily exercise, lifetime healthy BMI, moderate diet) and otherwise physically she is in extremely good shape for her age. But one of the early, subtle signs of her cognitive decline was a re…

Until we're allowed to muzzle humans or lock study subjects in a room for 5 years straight and carefully monitor/manage everything someone eats, it will always be hard to study something like this.

Re: Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline

#146

Post by acuozzo » Mon, Mar 06, 2023, 9:10 PM UTC

azakai wrote: post #6

eurasiantiger wrote: post #3

It seems likely that the culprit is not dietary, but PFAS contamination from storage, processing and packaging.

There are many other factors that could be relevant here. As the article says, ultra-processed food tends to be low in nutrients. Given the little we know, that seems as likely a cause as anything else here. Also, these are not randomized studies, as they also mention. So it is possible that, say, frozen meals are used more by a higher-risk population for other reasons (like cost), and this is just a correlation.

> ultra-processed food tends to be low in nutrients

This is good news! If a food is low in macronutrients like protein, fats, and carbohydrates, then it's low in calories by definition. Score!

Re: Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline

#147

Post by missingrib » Mon, Mar 06, 2023, 9:25 PM UTC

Dylan16807 wrote: post #71

RobertRoberts wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Freshly baked bread is available to _everyone_. Buy some flour, take a cup of flour, mix some water, maybe some salt, squish it some and bake it. The downfall of society will happen within arms length of wisdom and knowledge.

There's a reason bakeries are so prevalent in many areas. That "squish it" part is a lot of work, and you have to wait long enough that it's not available for breakfast. Making it yourself counts as hard to obtain every day.

Bread probably isn't very healthy anyway, so it's okay to cut it out of your diet.

Re: Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline

#148

Post by TedDoesntTalk » Mon, Mar 06, 2023, 9:27 PM UTC

olddustytrail wrote: post #122

TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Careful of your rice intake. Lots of rice has arsenic, cadmium, and lead. It is part of growth and nothing to do with processing or packaging. There are even warnings from the FDA not to feed babies baby food that contains rice products.

This is scaremongering nonsense. Literally 30 seconds of Googling would have told you that. Make more effort.

It is not. Try googling this:

https://www.google.com/search?q=rice%20heavy%20metals

https://www.google.com/search?q=rice+arsenic+lead+cadmium+fd...

Re: Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline

#149

Post by dmonitor » Mon, Mar 06, 2023, 9:27 PM UTC

steponlego wrote: post #140

dfxm12 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you want to understand what the average American consumes the answer is whatever is on the shelf of their local Walmart (they sell groceries). This is the crux of the matter: we can only buy what is on our shelves. If we have to start looking at ingredients lists, I think we've already lost the plot. Why are these questionable things on our shelves in the first place? Likely because they're cheaper to make, or wor…

Walmart sells flour, eggs, milk… and it’s doubtful that plastic tube bread is cheaper when you can make a loaf yourself for about thirty cents.

it’s the hidden costs of time and knowledge are a factor to be accounted for.

Re: Ultra-processed foods may contribute to cognitive decline

#150

Post by dmoy » Mon, Mar 06, 2023, 9:30 PM UTC

parineum wrote: post #139

Dylan16807 wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I didn't say too difficult, no. But there are so many super-local bakers around the world. Single neighborhoods are willing to pay full-time wages to a baker just so they don't have to make their own bread. Explain why they do that if daily bread-making isn't a pain in the ass. Or is this just that you don't think I should use the word "hard" to mean "pain in the ass"? It comes out of your money/time budget either wa…

There's a bit of a conflict between your post and it's grandparent. > Freshly baked bread can be hard to obtain in many parts of the US. For me if I wanted fresh baked bread every day and not make it myself, I'd be looking at like 40-60 minutes of extra time per day if I drive there every day. and > But there are so many super-local bakers around the world. Single neighborhoods are willing to pay full-time wages to a…

> Which I have two thoughts on, first, I'm pretty sure most people are buying bread at the grocery store. So, the availability of fresh bread (which is also frequently available in the grocery store bakery) has more to do with lack of demand than it does with lack of availability. It seems like the convenience of pre-sliced bread that doesn't go bad in a couple days is just vastly preferred over fresh bread.

No my point is that going to the grocery store daily or near daily for fresh bread adds like an hour of time to my day, because there's no very close grocery store. Not even talking about a dedicated bakery