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Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

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Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

#81

Post by bogomipz »

Relatedly, this announcement came on the same day they announced they were pausing the second phase of their HQ2 development in Virginia:

https://www.fastcompany.com/90860480/amazon-hq2-construction...

This is significant in that the HQ2 bidding process was basically a competition by local governments to see who could give Amazon the largest tax breaks and other incentives so that Amazon would choose their city as the site its location. See:

https://www.brookings.edu/research/five-economic-development...

Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

#82

Post by mozman »

tchock23 wrote: post #56
crazygringo wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In basically every retail store, and especially grocery/convenience stores, you are being observed by security cameras at literally every second. In every aisle. This has been the case for decades. It's how they catch shoplifters. I rather like the fact it can be used for customer convenience now, rather than just punitively.

I was on a jury for larceny from a Target. The footage they showed from so many points around the store made me feel creeped out with every store I go into now.

Target has a very impressive security system. There is a uuid on your receipt that can be used to track your movement within the store beginning from when you walked in

They also have a top forensic lab that some smaller law enforcement units rely on, and they do it for free!

https://corporate.target.com/article/2012/02/an-unexpected-c...

Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

#83

Post by adrianmonk »

Nanana909 wrote: post #69
TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was trying to return a package, not shop at the store. You can return Amazon packages at WholeFoods, Kohl’s and the UPS Store using the Amazon website on your phone — app not needed. I do it all the time because I refuse to use their app.

> He was trying to return a package, not shop at the store. So then it sounds like he’s not in very a strong position to declare the stores as an unmitigated failure…

After re-reading, I think their point may have been to describe that one experience as a total failure, not the cashierless store concept in general.

But it definitely can be read either way, so that's confusing.

Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

#84

Post by vlovich123 »

crazygringo wrote: post #23
nomy99 wrote: post #10

I shopped at their location at 30 rock. It was a mixed bag feeling. I was in awe of the technology, but at the same time I felt like I was being overly observed like in a prison.. I never went back, even though I work in the building.

In basically every retail store, and especially grocery/convenience stores, you are being observed by security cameras at literally every second. In every aisle. This has been the case for decades. It's how they catch shoplifters. I rather like the fact it can be used for customer convenience now, rather than just punitively.

And yet everything is now behind locked glass at the pharmacy. I doubt the cameras are that good at catching shoplifters.

Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

#85

Post by ChuckNorris89 »

nprateem wrote: post #34
ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>I wanted to be able to just go in a store and grab a juice or an apple and then leave the store. So, basically something a vending machine could provide? We've had those since like the '50s, except without computer vision, user tracking and machine learning. I don't know why Amazon was trying to reinvent the wheel here in the most expensive way possible.

To stock more than 20 products?

So, more of them and bigger and having employees stock them up from the back like these British ones from the '60s?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y3rGPXXk8VE

Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

#86

Post by di456 »

nprateem wrote: post #30

I had to go to one to return a package. I couldn't get past the turnstiles because I don't use the app and don't know my password because I use a password manager. This meant I couldn't hand my parcel in at the counter. The woman on the turnstile wouldn't let me in even when I explained the situation. So she went off and got a scanner to take my package. She didn't offer a receipt, and when I asked for one said it wa…

Is the app required for a return or can you use your credit card to enter? I've always just used my credit card to enter but have never done a return at one.

Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

#87

Post by kube-system »

raverbashing wrote: post #78
TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was trying to return a package, not shop at the store. You can return Amazon packages at WholeFoods, Kohl’s and the UPS Store using the Amazon website on your phone — app not needed. I do it all the time because I refuse to use their app.

Thanks for confirming you need to login into Amazon in some form to do this

You need to login to Amazon to purchase things from Amazon.

Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

#88

Post by sosodev »

kentosi wrote: post #8

Slightly misleading title. They're closing 8 of their stores across NYC, SF, etc, and this is after they just opened a few more across the US.

They built one of these near us (years ago) and never opened it. They recently announced that it was going to remain unopened indefinitely.

Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

#89

Post by Someone1234 »

crazygringo wrote: post #39
Someone1234 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In typical stores (e.g. Walmart, Target, etc), most of those cameras housings don't contain cameras. The main issue isn't that cameras are expensive, it is that monitoring that many cameras is expensive/impractical, and automated theft detection systems are still in their infancy. So they just target high value/common areas, and rely on deterrents (like people believing they have a lot of cameras, off-duty cops at th…

> most of those cameras housings don't contain cameras Do you have a source for that? Because at my local grocery store for example, above the customer service area they have a whole wall of TV's showing the live camera feeds. They're all working. My local convenience store has the live TV's too, by the cashier.

> Do you have a source for that?

I know people who work there.

Your average Walmart has hundreds of camera housings. Every single aisle has a couple. The amount of cabling alone to populate them all simply doesn't exist (as you can often see, it is an open-box ceiling), and monitoring that many cameras is impractical (in particular for a store staffed at BARELY sustainable levels).

Just look at how understaffed the floor of these stores are, then ask yourself why they'd have a disproportionate number of loss-prevention staff working relative to the floor staff. A big store absolutely will have tens of cameras, but even all those may only have a single person for all (or zero persons depending on shifts/staffing).

That being said: Some stores have legitimately rolled out facial recognition to pick up known thieves as they enter the store. But that requires four-ish cameras and the technology is pretty turn-key.

Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle

#90

Post by kube-system »

ilikehurdles wrote: post #74
TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

He was trying to return a package, not shop at the store. You can return Amazon packages at WholeFoods, Kohl’s and the UPS Store using the Amazon website on your phone — app not needed. I do it all the time because I refuse to use their app.

And yet the app _is_ needed at these stores. Perhaps he was confused and thought he was at a Kohl’s, a store that doesn’t need the app.

I have returned items at all three and I always show the return instructions from my email, because it is easier to navigate than the app.
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