It likely came down to the location, the technology, or the price. Was there shrinkage?
Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle
51–60 of 416 posts
Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle
#52Despite these closures,the company will continue to open new Amazon Go stores, When asked why Amazon has decided to shutter the eight stores in Seattle, New York City and San Francisco, the spokesperson said that like with any retailer, Amazon periodically assesses its portfolio of stores and makes optimization decisions along the way. Theft
Except there will still be 7 stores in NYC and they didn't say theft.
Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle
#53I had to go to one to return a package. I couldn't get past the turnstiles because I don't use the app and don't know my password because I use a password manager. This meant I couldn't hand my parcel in at the counter. The woman on the turnstile wouldn't let me in even when I explained the situation. So she went off and got a scanner to take my package. She didn't offer a receipt, and when I asked for one said it wa…
> I don't use the app So then why attempt to go to a store that’s entirely based on using the app? The store concept is based around your account - and you didn’t know your account details. The app can help avoid this, but you also refused to use the app. How is this any different than someone who refuses to use their password to sign in to Amazon.com and complains about not being able to submit a return? Or going to…
It’s listed as a drop-off location when you’re returning a traditional web order. There’s no warning about it being an innavigable dystopia in the return flow. I had the same experience.
Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle
#54I've always wondered: Do we really need to put people in shops? We have had vending machines for centuries, most kinds of shops (that don't need a social aspect) could easily just be sealed warehouses with product dispensers dotted outside the walls.
There are very few items I would ever buy from such a store. You can't really get a good look at the items in a vending machine, and you can't put an item back.
But for something you've always bought, the mundane daily items, you don't really need to check anything, same as with regular vending machines.
Returns could be implemented.
Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle
#55Amazon Go seems incredibly overengineered. Why is this superior than a portable scanning plus toggleable RFIDs that disable items on scan and alarm gates? Cameras everywhere and computer vision seems overkill.
Cost. RFIDs have to be manufactured and I think those add up fast. The antenna can be made of etched copper, but with prices as they can be, it might aslo be in aluminum or conductive ink. That many tags on that many products day after day.. I would imagine the commodity prices would deeply impact their use.
Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle
#56I shopped at their location at 30 rock. It was a mixed bag feeling. I was in awe of the technology, but at the same time I felt like I was being overly observed like in a prison.. I never went back, even though I work in the building.
In basically every retail store, and especially grocery/convenience stores, you are being observed by security cameras at literally every second. In every aisle. This has been the case for decades. It's how they catch shoplifters. I rather like the fact it can be used for customer convenience now, rather than just punitively.
I was on a jury for larceny from a Target. The footage they showed from so many points around the store made me feel creeped out with every store I go into now.
Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle
#57Earlier quoted context omitted.
In typical stores (e.g. Walmart, Target, etc), most of those cameras housings don't contain cameras. The main issue isn't that cameras are expensive, it is that monitoring that many cameras is expensive/impractical, and automated theft detection systems are still in their infancy. So they just target high value/common areas, and rely on deterrents (like people believing they have a lot of cameras, off-duty cops at th…
> most of those cameras housings don't contain cameras Do you have a source for that? Because at my local grocery store for example, above the customer service area they have a whole wall of TV's showing the live camera feeds. They're all working. My local convenience store has the live TV's too, by the cashier.
That’s not evidence that all the camera housings are populated. You’re only seeing the ones with live feeds.
Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle
#58Amazon Go seems incredibly overengineered. Why is this superior than a portable scanning plus toggleable RFIDs that disable items on scan and alarm gates? Cameras everywhere and computer vision seems overkill.
>Cameras everywhere and computer vision seems overkill. If the goal is cashierless, why not just have a store full of vending machines? You pick what you want, tap your card or phone, then you get it, then walk out.
"Vending machines you can walk into" is, amusingly, how I describe them to folks.
There is a bit of a misunderstanding on staffing, though. There are still about as many people as you would need for a grocery store of that size, from what I remember. They just don't work the checkout line. So, you get all of the restocking and similar capabilities that machines just can't do, yet.
Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
> I don't use the app So then why attempt to go to a store that’s entirely based on using the app? The store concept is based around your account - and you didn’t know your account details. The app can help avoid this, but you also refused to use the app. How is this any different than someone who refuses to use their password to sign in to Amazon.com and complains about not being able to submit a return? Or going to…
It’s listed as a drop-off location when you’re returning a traditional web order. There’s no warning about it being an innavigable dystopia in the return flow. I had the same experience.
Is that an issue with the store concept, or an issue with not making it clear to users that it’s a non standard drop off location? I don’t see the lack of a warning reflecting on the actual store itself very strongly.
Also- why even bother with Amazon and trying to return packages etc if you have no easy way of getting your password? If this is too much of a hassle just use in person stores..
I’ve had drop off at mail shops locations be unexpectedly closed which is objectively worse than having a bad but possible return experience…..and never once claimed that “mail shops are an unmitigated failure”
Re: Amazon is closing its cashierless stores in NYC, San Francisco and Seattle
#60I shopped at their location at 30 rock. It was a mixed bag feeling. I was in awe of the technology, but at the same time I felt like I was being overly observed like in a prison.. I never went back, even though I work in the building.
In basically every retail store, and especially grocery/convenience stores, you are being observed by security cameras at literally every second. In every aisle. This has been the case for decades. It's how they catch shoplifters. I rather like the fact it can be used for customer convenience now, rather than just punitively.
One example of this from a quick search: https://privacysos.org/blog/target-is-really-really-into-sur...
More information on some of Target's loss prevention techniques: https://www.businessinsider.com/target-employees-say-store-d... (Archive link: https://archive.is/wRol8)
I'd heard that they wait until losses reach above the felony threshold before prosecuting, documenting what particular individuals are stealing. Several videos about this had gone viral, and I'd heard about it from a friend but never looked into it until now.
From the Business Insider interview with several anonymous employees, though, the intent of the surveillance is more to catch high volume thieves, employees stealing, and career shoplifters, rather than folks stealing a few necessities. I could see most of their prosecutions rising to the felony threshold because of this tactic, since high volume is likely to cross the dollar amount for a felony. In other words, the intent is not being punitive for the sake of it, but actual loss prevention.
I tend to believe the anonymous sources, because they have nothing to gain from talking anonymously with the reporter, versus the influencers who are trying to accumulate followers. It's not a Les Miserables type situation.
A lot of the commenters on one particular video linked from the article seem to be pro-shoplifting, even without need, so there is to some extent people believing what they want to believe: https://www.tiktok.com/@jodessy/video/6899962247590743301
Examples:
"All I'm hearing is I have $499 in store credit" - 1700 likes
"I'm sorry but what?? I've stolen CELL PHONES from target" - 242 likes
"I def stole over $20k including but not limited to laptops, jbl speakers, ... only got probation so jokes on them!" - 103 likes
Anyway, I just thought I'd share this even though it's only tangentially related to the story since I'd just previously believed the viral rumor without really looking into it.