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Banning words won’t make the world more just

theatlantic.com

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Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#891
post #603
post #363

What was it, 10 to 20 years ago, people started to be noticeably nervous when they were coming near a description of my disability. It used to be so simple. I am 100% blind, and guess what, I prefer the term blind because it is pretty descriptive and relatively short. But all of a sudden, people external to the community started to fumble around with "visually challenged", and all the nonsense variations of that in m…

I have a similar story: When I was a child, I was diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome. This is now malady non grata: For one thing, it's been folded into autism spectrum disorder, the DSM-5 being more on the lumper end of things than previous DSMs were, and, for another, it has a checkered history, with Hans Asperger using his position as a doctor in Vienna during the Second World War to choose which children were sav…

> Later still, the very word "Autism" seems to have faded out of polite speech, with people like me being referred to as "on the spectrum" with no explicit mention of which spectrum

It is terribly ignorant, because people who use "spectrum" as an alias for autism/ASD don't know that psychiatry/psychology contains many other "spectrums" – the schizophrenia spectrum, the obsessive-compulsive spectrum, the bipolar spectrum, the disruptive behaviour disorder spectrum, the trauma spectrum, etc, etc. The autism and schizophrenia spectrums are the only two which have officially made it into the DSM-5, but the others are all actively used in research and clinically, and the obsessive-compulsive spectrum was originally planned to be included (but for whatever reason didn't make the cut).

> The final point is person-first language and why I don't use it: I am an autistic person.

I seriously thought about paying a psychologist >$1000 for an autism assessment. Together, my psychiatrist and my psychologist [0] talked me out of it. They both said that if I really wanted a piece of paper saying that I had ASD, certainly some psychologist out there would be happy to take my money and give me one. But, their argument was, it wouldn't actually make any positive difference to my life, it would just be a waste of my time and money. And, for now at least, I decided to follow their advice. So am I an "autistic person" or not?

What is "autism"? "Asperger's"? "ASD"? Well, in part, they are scientific theories; in part, they are cultural constructs, whose existence and success is quite independent of the quality or truth of the scientific theory. Focusing just on the scientific theory side, how good is the evidence behind them? Most professionals, families, and people who identify with those labels assume the evidence must be really good. But, there are voices out there arguing that they are far from proven, that the science behind them is deeply flawed, even that we ought to drop them and look for better theories to replace them with. See [1] – and for a weaker but overlapping position, [2]. Is something really "fundamental enough to how we experience the world" if it is a scientific theory which could well turn out to be false, a dead-end, a wrong turn in the history of science? What if, one day, people look back on ASD/autism/Asperger's/etc just as we now look back on hysteria, phlogiston, the luminiferous aether, the Ptolemaic model, the steady-state universe, etc, etc, etc? What if "autism" is really no more fundamental to anyone's identity than hysteria was?

[0] my psychologist isn't qualified to diagnose ASD, hence he couldn't do it, I had to go to someone else. He could gain that qualification if he wanted to – all it takes is just a few short courses – but he isn't interested in practicing in that area. Similar story for my psychiatrist – he told me if any patient asks him about an ASD diagnosis, he tells them to see a psychologist for that instead, he doesn't want to get involved in it

[1] https://link.springer.com/article/10.1007/s40489-016-0085-x

[2] https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1002/aur.2494

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#892
post #415

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My partner is disabled, and by chance and via support groups she is a member of, she has many friends annd acquaintences who are as well. And while it's by no means universal, she and all her disabled friends absolutely loathe the "people first language" currently in vogue (ie, "person with a disability" over "disabled"). And it's odd! Because while there are certainly disabled people who prefer one form over another…

Ironically it's the opposite in the autism community, the white Knights insist it should be "autistic people" for some reason. None of this is going to change anyone's material conditions, it's just a distraction invented by well paid "diversity consultants". At least the fad for "differently abled" seems to have died.

Depends on if you’re talking to autistic people, or professionals who work with autistic people/their parents.

The latter group still tends to use “person with autism” and I think it’s more funny than anything but people get really pissed at people who developed this vocabulary without actually asking Autistic people what they thought of it.

I love the phrasing “person with autism” because it allows me to make a bunch of fairly accurate assumptions about the type of person you are, which is generally somebody who sees autism in a very paternalistic light. Why stigmatize the use of language where somebody self-identifies themselves as hostile to your interests and seeing themselves as being your woke saviour? What was that saying - don’t interrupt your enemy while they’re making a mistake?

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#893

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Kiev to Kyiv Why is this an instance of the phenomenon? Isn't Kyiv closer to what a Ukrainian would say?

Do anglos read Kiev and Kyiv particularly differently in the first place? In any case, it sounds further from a normative Ukrainian pronunciation than Caillou.

I read Kiev with an /ɛ/ sound, and Kyiv with an /ɪ/ sound.

In my head, at least. I've just realized that I haven't needed to verbally refer to this place since I became aware of the renaming. In fact, I don't know that I've ever said either one out loud.

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#894
post #883
post #363

What was it, 10 to 20 years ago, people started to be noticeably nervous when they were coming near a description of my disability. It used to be so simple. I am 100% blind, and guess what, I prefer the term blind because it is pretty descriptive and relatively short. But all of a sudden, people external to the community started to fumble around with "visually challenged", and all the nonsense variations of that in m…

I also wish we could call it the "master" branch, renaming the primary branch to "main" is just pointless. But it's simply less risky and less work to just call it "main". It doesn't matter, and nobody gains anything from calling it "main" -- but if we call it "master" someone might get offended or waste my time arguing over it. There is no incentive to insist calling it "master". So similarly, I guess we'll end up c…

As a rule, I don’t complain about changes in language that make things more terse or clear. Main is better than master.

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#895
post #363

What was it, 10 to 20 years ago, people started to be noticeably nervous when they were coming near a description of my disability. It used to be so simple. I am 100% blind, and guess what, I prefer the term blind because it is pretty descriptive and relatively short. But all of a sudden, people external to the community started to fumble around with "visually challenged", and all the nonsense variations of that in m…

I think it all starts from a good place. Would you rather people just using words "carelessly" without regard to how you might feel? It's questioning the assumption that the word used is fine throughout history. I don't think there is anything nefarious about it, just that "people" always co-opt the motives in the end and make it muddled for their own benefit. Overthinking it I guess. I know it when I see it, but it'…

[deleted]

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#896
post #603
post #363

What was it, 10 to 20 years ago, people started to be noticeably nervous when they were coming near a description of my disability. It used to be so simple. I am 100% blind, and guess what, I prefer the term blind because it is pretty descriptive and relatively short. But all of a sudden, people external to the community started to fumble around with "visually challenged", and all the nonsense variations of that in m…

I have a similar story: When I was a child, I was diagnosed with Asperger's Syndrome. This is now malady non grata: For one thing, it's been folded into autism spectrum disorder, the DSM-5 being more on the lumper end of things than previous DSMs were, and, for another, it has a checkered history, with Hans Asperger using his position as a doctor in Vienna during the Second World War to choose which children were sav…

Autism is an insult, it’s a shortened version of “autism spectrum disorder”, disorder is intrinsically an insulting word, and the diagnostic criteria describes variations in human behaviour as dysfunctions and so on.

The increased use of “autism” as an insult and people avoiding it is because it is an insult and always was from its conception. That is why doctors regularly try and plot to screen people’s DNA for this “autism” to exterminate them from the gene pool. Because it’s a bad thing they want to destroy, despite the fact it’s a “spectrum” disorder and thus is a label of convenience and there’s not really such a thing as “the autism gene”.

Which to me makes the whole “autistic person” vs “person with autism” stuff pointless. You’re either a disordered person or a person with a disorder, put a gun to my head and I prefer disordered person. I react with offence to any such labels on the grounds that “Asperger’s” is obsolete and “autism” was never diagnosed so people and call me disordered as shorthand to describe me can fuck themselves because I don’t want to deal with the stigma of a label which was thrust upon me through incredibly pseudoscientific means. The dsm-iv which I was diagnosed under was called a “noble lie” by one of its chief author’s.

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#897
post #883
post #363

What was it, 10 to 20 years ago, people started to be noticeably nervous when they were coming near a description of my disability. It used to be so simple. I am 100% blind, and guess what, I prefer the term blind because it is pretty descriptive and relatively short. But all of a sudden, people external to the community started to fumble around with "visually challenged", and all the nonsense variations of that in m…

I also wish we could call it the "master" branch, renaming the primary branch to "main" is just pointless. But it's simply less risky and less work to just call it "main". It doesn't matter, and nobody gains anything from calling it "main" -- but if we call it "master" someone might get offended or waste my time arguing over it. There is no incentive to insist calling it "master". So similarly, I guess we'll end up c…

You can use whatever branch name you want.

I think that it is probably not necessary or helpful to rename branches in existing repositories, but you can do that if it is helpful for what you are doing.

If you upload a repository to GitHub, you can use whatever default branch name it already has with no problem. I know because I did upload one that uses "trunk" as the default branch name, and it did not cause any problem. (I used "trunk" as the default branch name because it is a mirror of a fossil repository which uses "trunk" as the default branch name.)

(And, someone does get a minor benefit to call it "main"; it is two letters shorter than "master". Of course, that is minor, but it isn't quite nothing.)

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#898
This reminds me of a scene in my favorite movie, "The Big lebowski". IIRC, the dude is complaining about a 'chinaman' peeing on his rug. Walter goes on one of his rants and ends with "By the way, Asian-American is the preferred term". It always struck me as curious that the peeing guy, that Walter is presumably advocating for wasn't even present in the scene. All this hullabaloo and most times, the affected person isn't even there. Indeed, pronouns are instructions for how people must refer to you when you are not present!

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#899

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> It is so weird, because it adds yet another layer of distance between "us" and the "normal" people. Yeah, and those "sensitive" people also don't seem to get what normal means. It just means "how the majority is supposed to be/the baseline fully functioning state regarding X". It's not a moral judgement if one is not in the normal group regarding some ability. > Its a weird phenomenon. The longer I watch all of thi…

This line is probably smaller than it may appear. The reason much of this language policing started is because of the dominant group using language to reinforce the inferiority of a less powerful group. It’s always easier for the dominant group to say “it’s just words — no one cares” since the words are never at their expense.

>The reason much of this language policing started is because of the dominant group using language to reinforce the inferiority of a less powerful group.

I think it's the inverse: the reason this language policing started was because the dominant group had reduced its hold... That why it started when it started and not when things were much worse...

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#900

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Man: Adult Human with XY sex Chromosomes Woman: Adult Human with XX sex Chromosomes

So individuals with Swyer syndrome who overwhemingly identify as women... are men. And anyone that falls outside this binary definition... is neither man nor woman?

technically? yes
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