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My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

blog.dijit.sh

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Re: My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

#221

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Try this with Linux. Seriously. Sit down and do the equivalent: many servers in parallel On my phone so not going to type the full command line out ostensibly it would be: xargs ssh ‘ps process-name’ I’d need to pull the man pages up to double check which flags you’ve specifically requested. But the above is the general gist of it. —— I think it’s pointless to compare such granular features side by side though. For…

> But the above is the general gist of it. It's not even remotely the gist of it. The output of that is formatted (pretty-printed) text, not CSV. You won't know which computer the output came from. You can't use this output in any meaningful way. It's not useful to the business . ssh can't connect to multiple servers at once (other tools like multissh can). However, most such tools aren't designed for and aren't capa…

> It's not even remotely the gist of it. The output of that is formatted (pretty-printed) text, not CSV. You won't know which computer the output came from. You can't use this output in any meaningful way. It's not useful to the business.

You can add all of that easily. Printing hostnames or turning text to CSV isnt a hard job on any computer. I was doing this in the 90s on Windows, years before Powershell. And on pre-OSX macs (think System 8 and 9) connected via AppleTalk. So modern Linux systems are clearly not going to struggle in that regard.

And you’re now just doing exactly what you criticised the author for: making up bullshit requirements based on what you’re familiar with and then using that as some lame excuse to call everything else garbage.

> ssh can't connect to multiple servers at once (other tools like multissh can). However, most such tools aren't designed for and aren't capable of scaling up to a thousand or more servers.

You’re making distinction that doesn’t exist. It doesn’t matter if you’re spinning up multiple SSH sessions from one program, or multiple programs each with a singular SSH session. It’s still the same number of outbound network connections (and likely same number of processes too).

What matters is how those connections are managed. And the code I exampled does run those connections in parallel.

> Windows PowerShell and WinRM can

Bash can. It just needs to call a process. Just as PowerShell is calling a process to do it.

Saying SSH cannot whereas Powershell can is comparing apples to oranges. SSH isn’t itself a shell, it’s a secure client/server protocol that allows you to run remote code inside a pseudo-TTY. Generally that would be a shell, but it doesn’t have to be.

(Source: I’ve written multiple shells for both Windows and Linux over the years)

> yet people like you just blindly dismiss it,

That’s not what I did. You’re now making assumptions about me. Ironically “blindly dismissing” my comments in the process.

> assuming that it "must" be worse than Unix/Linux,

I dont need to make assumptions. I have a hell of a lot of experience managing Windows systems. 25+ years in fact.

I’ve also written plenty of server side software for Windows too. And network enabled Windows malware (pre-NT4 college network. I mostly just used it to siphon off other peoples quotas from the college ISDN line. But it taught me enough to earn a career in IT)

> since everyone knows that Windows doesn't even have a shell!

Literally no one said that outside of the article.

Windows clearly has several shells: explorer.exe, cmd.exe, Powershell. Plus lots of frontends for remote services via RPC.

I also credited RDP as being excellent too.

> To quote the original article: "there was nothing to lean back on: no shell"

I’m not the author of that article so I don’t really understand why you’re using that to prove a point about my own ignorance.

> Windows has a shell, the author of the article just wasn't aware of its existence, let alone its comparative feature set.

We aren’t talking about the article though. We were talking about your generalised point that Windows is easier to administer than UNIX-like platforms.

If truth be told, I stopped reading the article after about 3 paragraphs because it was pretty obvious that it wasn’t a well thought out piece. But that doesn’t mean I agree with you any more than the author. You’re both at the extreme opposite ends of reality.

Re: My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

#222
post #212
post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe games usually have assets too and not just metadata, would you put gbs of data in Postgres row ?

Assets don't go into database lmao.

yes and that's how I know you never worked in the game industry. A lot of companies use perforce, perforce is a source control system that also has assets, and also has metadata, that you also have to take backups and query.

Re: My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

#223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Underrated comment. Many people believe their manager does nothing... until they become a manager and realize all the BS their manager protected them from on the daily.

So the idea isn't the manager is incompetent but his managers are so bad they are a net negative and cause so much disruption that a full time employee is required to deal with it.

They could all be great managers and literal geniuses and it wouldn't matter. Each person you add to an org increases the number of connections and communications required to do something.

To get anything done I have to get Safety, and Compliance, and Marketing, and Sales, and Project Management, and Vendor Management, and Product Management, plus the Product Dev Team, plus any sister Dev Teams, plus QA involved. Also gotta check with Security, and confirm our Infra team can host it.

Inevitably these people will have their own things going on and may not be available. They will have to wrestle with their own complexity. This leads to meeting after meeting. Then there will be paperwork. A lot of it. Maybe I don't need most of those teams involved but I need sign-offs about that.

Plus each of those teams is there for a reason. If I ignore Compliance we get sued -- and each lawsuit is going to cost a lot more than the cost of those meetings. If Marketing isn't involved then the product launch will screw up and the offering won't go anywhere. If QA isn't there than the product will suck, or maybe screw up catastrophically.

Even if every single manager, every single C-level, every single team lead and Sr., is a bonified genius, it's still going to be a mountain of lame, pedantic work. If there was a way to ditch that then I'm sure, somewhere, one of these MIT Berkeley Disrupter-types would have done so, but the reality is that's how any org larger than like 100 people is going to work.

Re: My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

#224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"When you do things right, people won't be sure you've done anything at all." - Futurama

This quote has, pound for pound, provided more comfort to terrible leaders than any other. It’s also just not true, good leadership is very obvious.

Good leadership is only obvious in conflict or chaos. When everything is simple, it's easy for shit managers to look like good ones.

Re: My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

#225
post #181

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm well aware of the existence of powershell and CMD, such things are not a real luxury when you're limited to whatever Windows provides you with as utilities as opposed to the astonishingly wide plethora of commandline utilities available else where (where everything is a file and is easy to read, parse, filter, save-). Windows 2012r2 came with Powershell 4.0, which I'm sure you'll agree was limited in ways that ba…

Export-Csv was introduced in PowerShell v1.0: https://social.technet.microsoft.com/wiki/contents/articles/... > but it's not as simple as `ssh user@host` It is literally that simple. Nay, simpler , because authentication is automatic and secure: Enter-PSSession 'hostname' Oh, I'm sorry... too verbose and readable. etsn 'hostname' > since bash is a collection of utilities[1] and doesn't require deep integration with t…

> It is literally that simple. Nay, simpler, because authentication is automatic and secure:

You keep saying that as if there’s no such thing as secure automatic authentication on SSH yet people have been doing exactly that since before AD was even a thing.

> Three "Linux admins" failed at this task, and I had to resort to using ChatGPT and then fixing up the result by testing it against a dozen VMs that took me a day to spin up.

You do realise that you can get bad Linux sysadmins as well as bad Windows administrators?

Plus it’s not really fair to compare managing different distributions to managing a Windows (unless you’re counting Windows 95 and CE as part of your fleet). Most businesses standardise on one Linux distro (or BSD flavour) and only diversify from that if that absolutely have to. It’s not because Linux is harder than Windows. It’s because managing multiple different core stacks is harder regardless of whether that’s Linux and Windows. Or Linux and BSD. Or Windows 95 and Windows XP. Or different base distributions of Linux.

The first rule of managing large fleets of servers is homogenise as much of it as you can.

Re: My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

#226
post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> And then... We realized how much politics, uncertainty, churn, screaming, changing requirements, ambiguous priorities and other carp he protected us from :-/ Over years I've noticed like 80% of those is because other managers are terrible and it so happens that the dept. I'm in takes some of the fallout of their mess.

>...because other managers are terrible... It's interesting you should say this because this is one of the categories of Bullshit jobs as defined by David Graeber in his book. And incidentally only y'day I was listening to him on a podcast[1] speaking about BS jobs. His favourite example is corporate lawyers. Companies are forced to hire them just because other companies have them and are in fear of getting sued. I h…

I listened to it and I want that hour of my life back...

Re: My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

#227
post #8

My manager doesn't do almost anything. I wonder why they keep him around. He has like two reports and we're both fully self-directed. He can't understand technical issues, and whenever he proposes something, it's completely untenable due to his lack of understanding what's useful or possible.

It is definitely possible they indeed don't do anything. Fwiw though - a decade ago when I was a sysadmin I had a manager that I was certain never did anything. And then he was replaced. And then... We realized how much politics, uncertainty, churn, screaming, changing requirements, ambiguous priorities and other carp he protected us from :-/ Not saying it's the case with your manager. But managers have duties roles…

A manager I respected, opened up to me and said his unstated role was that of a "shock absorber".

Take shocks coming down, going up, sideways and to keep the ride smooth for as long as possible.

I also saw him stand up for the team when needed.

He got kicked out of his job. Along with the whole team.

Re: My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

#228
post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That's just not true. It feels true to Unix admins trying to do Unix things on Windows and getting frustrated when nothing feels familiar. Let me quote the article directly: "no SSH" WinRM is roughly equivalent and superior in many ways. E.g.: It takes quite the effort to produce a report of "some setting or flag" across a fleet of servers with SSH, Bash, Sed, Awk, etc.. Now try this with PowerShell: Invoke-Command -…

cat list_of_servers | parallel --tag ssh {} ps -aux The whole point of UNIX is to use independent, composable tools that speak the same interface. If the interface is space-separated values, use space-separated values. If Excel or PowerBI don't use that then don't use Excel or PowerBI.

Your boss uses Excel and doesn't like it when the reports\ read\ like\ this because you ignored his requirements. Your coworker is also angry at you now, because when he scheduled your script to run regularly, the output occasionally turns into gibberish because of inconsistent handling of special characters and error conditions, breaking automations randomly.

I spotted several errors in your provided "solution", which ought not be possible, because I'm a person that uses Linux briefly every few years.

The problem statement isn't a made up, artificial, or toy scenario. The few times I have to use Linux, it's to do this kind of activity. "Run a command on all Linux servers in the data centre" is something I had to do just recently, and it turned into a multi-month exercise involving six people. It would have been an hour with Windows. Think "look for log4j", "install an agent", or "report on the kernel version used".

Problems like this seem trivial, but it is precisely the independent nature of those tools that makes them not composable.

For example, 'ps' has different output and different capabilities on different systems! You can't naively run it across multiple systems, because output will be an inconsistent mess. You can't then sort, filter, aggregate, or do anything useful with its output.

"aux" is the wrong option to use. It'll pretty-print the output, which forces it to truncate long values. It'll return date times with inconsistent offsets, depending on each server's individual time zone and regional settings. It'll strip the year off, so if you want the 'date' a process started, it won't be obvious if it has been running for 1 month or 13 months.

If any servers aren't already in your ssh keychain, then your command will... what? Freeze? Output errors into the report? Prompt for your input thousands of times, one per server? In parallel? How... did you expect this to work!?

Re: My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

#229
post #146
post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is very frustrating that many of the NoSQL databases aren't ACID. Some even say they are, but they aren't. Frustrating to me because we have one that is, and it's a lot of work and harder to win benchmarks against the ones that fake it or aren't.

Which ones are lying?

I don't want the liability for this, so I'm not going to say. Perhaps I should just delete the comment.

Re: My manager spent $1M on a backup server that I never used

#230

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This quote has, pound for pound, provided more comfort to terrible leaders than any other. It’s also just not true, good leadership is very obvious.

Good leadership is only obvious in conflict or chaos. When everything is simple, it's easy for shit managers to look like good ones.

Maybe you’ve never experienced good management? Good managers are significantly different in very obvious ways even in the absence of conflict.

A good managers job is not just helping you navigate chaos.

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