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Banning words won’t make the world more just

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801–810 of 1001 posts

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#801

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Character and intent is what matters. This. I recently ran up against a filter on Reddit where I used a phrase that I was completely unaware of. My account was flagged for hate speech. The comment had no ill-intent. The problem with language is that we want individual words to have inherent meaning but as people adopt phrases to identify a movement, those meanings get carried along for the ride. eg: until recently,…

I find it highly unlikely that Scott Adams is a "dark dog whistle" kinda guy. At best the most I'd believe would be that "some people who Scott Adams pissed off now like to say that when he says X he actually means Y".

If you listen to the video of what Scott Adams says, he's quite explicit about it. It doesn't seem like a plausible misspeak. He didn't merely say "It's okay to be white" in an ambiguous context (plausibly not related to the 4chan propaganda campaign.) He said that because some poll claims whatever% of black people disagree with the phrase, that black people are a hate group, that white people should stay away from them, and that he would no longer advocate for black interests. If you don't trust my paraphrasing, fair enough, but you can watch the video yourself and I think you'll find that my paraphrasing is fairly accurate.

Suppose for the sake of argument the poll is legitimate, and suppose he wasn't aware that the phrase is a 4chan propaganda slogan.. I think he still grievously erred when he decided to judge all black people by the opinions of only a portion of black people, as though black were a political affiliation that people can enter or leave at will. But it's not a political affiliation, it's an ethnic group. You legitimately can't claim that an entire ethnic group is a "hate group" because whatever% of them believe hateful things, even if that statistic is true. It's not as though the remaining% can disassociate themselves from the ethnic group, it isn't a voluntary association. I think his failure to distinguish an ethnic classification (involuntary association) from an ideological classification (voluntary association) is where he really went off the rails with no plausible deniability.

I interpret this whole affair as: he's rich, wants to retire, and decided now is as good a time as any to finally speak his mind. He lost his inhibitions.

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#802

"The American Cancer Society advises that Latinx, along with the equally gender-neutral Latine, Latin@, and Latinu, “may or may not be fully embraced by older generations and may need additional explanation.” Cool cool, I look forward as a white guy to explaining to a group of Spanish people why they are wrong and are really LatinX and I'm doing it for their protection. Imagine being an immigrant and having to learn…

And there was no need for bringing up this unreadable "Latinx" word in the first place. There's already a centuries-old gender-neutral word for Latino/Latina that is, surprise, "Latin". Or "Latin person" if you will. I was born in South America, and I really reject being called a "Latinx". It sounds dehumanizing.

I think the only sensible way to resist this is to poke fun at it. Humor did a great job at whittling away the absurdities of the Soviet Union, and it can do the same with this dystopian diversity nonsense.

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#803

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There seems to be this weird erasure of women taking place at the moment. This is the crazy thing. After a century of legitimate struggle for equality, women are having the language of feminism turned on them to deny the existence of femininity. Honestly, I thought the lines would have been drawn with sport, but that fact that it's leaking into medicine is pure insanity. I've been somewhat worried about there not b…

I sometimes feel this is some nefarious plan to reconstruct a new masculinity. It won't be as "toxic" as the old version, but we'll be back on top. I've heard "menstruators", "birthing persons", "chest feeding", "vulva havers". I've heard lots of debate about letting trans women compete. Debate about allowing trans women into women's toilets. Or arguing the sincerity of men who claim to identify as women as they are…

[deleted]

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#804
post #632
post #363

What was it, 10 to 20 years ago, people started to be noticeably nervous when they were coming near a description of my disability. It used to be so simple. I am 100% blind, and guess what, I prefer the term blind because it is pretty descriptive and relatively short. But all of a sudden, people external to the community started to fumble around with "visually challenged", and all the nonsense variations of that in m…

I once had an injury in both of my legs after a long hike. It caused my legs to be so swollen that I had very limited mobility, but I could still walk - though it probably looked very awkward. In school, children get taught that when someone looks disabled, you shouldn't look at them, because staring at them is some kind of discrimination or so. I couldn't disagree more. When I had that injury, and was kind of crip-w…

> When I had that injury, and was kind of crip-walking, people would intuitively stare at me for a second, then -very obviously- force themselves to look away.

> The injury wasn't that bad and went away after a week or two. But the way people forced themselves to look away, was much worse. I can't imagine dealing with that every day.

Having experienced this, I personally find that what's worse is the way people look at me in the first place. It's not as simple as someone looking at me, I can _see_ on their face or in their eyes or ... what's going through their mind, before they reassert control and hide it again.

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#805
post #188

Earlier quoted context omitted.

TFA is about "equity language". Let's stay on topic.

The topic is your comment, and my reply is quite on topic. > Let's remain using the OED from circa 2006 You literally said the English language, which has been evolving for over a thousand years, should stop changing as of 2006. That's what you said. You don't like these new words because you don't want the world to change from how it was in your own personal golden years. It's fine, it happens to everyone; I'm just…

You didn't read the article.

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#806

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I recently had a comment on another site flagged by a bot for using ableist language when I used the world "insane". It was a first for me as well. Will go with "batshit" next time.

It's insane there's backroom string-pullers trying to take out words like insane. Rick from Pawn Stars uses the word, so it's good enough for me! He often describes certain amazing facts or objects as insane. Because he likes those things. It can be positive. Is the motivation to onboard "use this list or be on wrong side of ethics and get nasty reviews"? there's an element of that. Microsoft 360, all that new stuff,…

It was more like "If you want to participate in this obviously PC online community, here's how we talk." They didn't ban me or even threaten to.

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#807
post #658

We should spend less time on the crazy outcomes of these institutes and more time on why they can even exist in the first place. They are somehow funded yet not accountable to anyone. Nobody asked for this, it doesn't help anyone, and it cannot survive the most basic scrutiny of the public or market. And yet it exists and even grows. Rather than playing whack-a-mole with outcomes, the underlying mechanism should be e…

Not to mention, the amount of violence committed by members of these outrage groups against whoever stands in their way - primarily towards the "offending" group or class they're prejudiced against, particularly whites, males, and straight sexual orientation. Worse, this violence often goes unaccounted for with impunity, without penalty, because people are terrified of the consequences of criticizing these groups, wh…

I don't think it makes sense to argue against the logic of identity politics by actively identifying as a victim, that only reproduces the very logic you are critiquing, since it is they who also view themselves as victims and who seek retribution for perceived violence against them as an identity group. This is the logic of Nazism at its core, and when you use it to defend traditional values it becomes even more blatantly obvious.

The horror (for you) is realizing that now this very same logic has been adopted by neo-liberal forces who seek to use radical politics not for freedom but to impose an even stricter, more terrible form of security, where it's not that people aren't allowed to speak their minds but rather that they police themselves first, they are unconsciously compelled to limit the range of acceptable discourse. Anybody who criticizes this regime is prevented by Corporate America from finding employment, effectively starving and killing them. Its fortunate that we have protected freedom of speech (at least in the US), but freedom of speech is not in the interest of our corporate masters and this regime of power limits it to the utmost degree for nobody in particular (since nobody benefits from this, in truth), but simply to serve a vast architecture of domination that most individuals in power are not even aware of, or aware they are being subjected too.

What most people fail to see is how neoliberal politics are WORSE than fascism--its almost like an advanced form of fascism, where the organized chaos of the market is utilized to rapidly generate victimhood and individual identities which rapidly alienate and atomize each and every person in society, who then believes their struggles are theirs alone, that resistance to power is futile because everyone fights their own battles, and that its not worth it to talk to anyone who isn't a member of your "identity", the numbers of which are so vast that it becomes impossible for anyone to talk to anyone else who has a difference of opinion, staying inside their little social bubbles which only interact through the means the very same technology and infrastructure employed in that domination.

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#808
post #363

What was it, 10 to 20 years ago, people started to be noticeably nervous when they were coming near a description of my disability. It used to be so simple. I am 100% blind, and guess what, I prefer the term blind because it is pretty descriptive and relatively short. But all of a sudden, people external to the community started to fumble around with "visually challenged", and all the nonsense variations of that in m…

Its this new concept that says you can only be a nice, respectful person if you sign up to a particular ideology and view the world through this lens.

This ideology is usually espoused by people who have only have a couple of years life experience as an adult yet believe they are best positioned to tell everybody else how to think and behave.

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#809
In my language there are three wordforms: masculine, feminitive and middle. If you want to harass someone you can just missplace a letter in any verb about some person and he will be insulted! English is enough good by not having such a word formation, why does somebody need to insist of euphemisms?

Re: Banning words won’t make the world more just

#810

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm involved in local politics in Oak Park, IL, also known as the People's Republic of Oak Park, 85.5% Clinton in '16, 72% college educated, median income about $15k higher than Evanston, and I have never heard any of these words in the elite white conversations I am continually dragged into. These guides get published to give The Groups something to do. Very few people in the real world --- yes, even the elite white…

> capitalizing Black, which is something our mutual fave John McWhorter has been advocating for some time Is this sarcasm? I am not quite sure what this is supposed to convey.

No, there is nothing sarcastic about this.
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