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U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

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Re: U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

#331

Post by robertlagrant »

angry_octet wrote: post #236
robertlagrant wrote: post #223

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> They have a solution and it's called a rain coat. So you're agreeing with previous commenter that the description is incorrect?

Additional protection would keep them 99% dry instead of 90% dry even in a storm. Right up to the point where they have to deliver a letter, where they would be 0% dry. It's more important to be able to get in and out easily.

I'm wondering whether you agree with the commenter that the claim about the vehicle in this regard is likely exaggerated.

Re: U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

#332

Post by Tade0 »

gffrd wrote: post #158
m4rtink wrote: post #94

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah - while it seems easy/logical to just swap a normal delivery vehicle for an electric version of it, you don't really have to do that & electric vehicles do come in many more shapes and sizes due to the might higher flexibility and scalability of the electric power system. For example here in Brno, Czech Republic, the entry to the city center is nowadays quite restrictive for regular cars/vans - a lot of it is a…

For some reason I find it really funny that there are Dominos in the Czech Republic …

Imagine if it was run by an Australian.

Re: U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

#333

Post by Tade0 »

comboy wrote: post #299
euroderf wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like this might be a case for solar panels on-board. Long delivery route, moderate speeds, open road.

From quick search electric car uses 0.15-0.2kWh per kilometer. That's amount of energy you get after delivering 200 Watts for an hour. Let's say you have 2m2 of roof (pretty generous), of very efficient panels in your driving in absolute optimal conditions when they are giving you full power (that's around 200W/m2). No loses on the inverter and such. So you need to be going at the speed of 2km/h. Well, that's actuall…

I suppose it makes sense to at least power the AC with them, as its drain correlates with the amount of sunlight.

Re: U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

#334

Post by diordiderot »

nine_k wrote: post #318
diordiderot wrote: post #260

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The US used to be littered with railroad. Density isn't a problem Here is a map from 189X[0] Auto supremacy was and still is a choice. [0] https://digital-collections.columbuslibrary.org/digital/api/...

The US is still littered with railroads, and rail carries a large amount of cargo. It's still not not as dense as UK, Germany, or Netherlands, and cannot be, outside areas like North-East. What makes sense around places like NYC, Chicago, or Seattle, may not work equally well in Nebraska. Building a road and running trucks on it is just more affordable. Also, rail is optimized to have ridiculously high throughput at…

> The US is still littered with railroads

Far far fewer than there used to be

> Building a road and running trucks on it is just more affordable.

Only if you discount negative externalities.

And you can't even know that for sure.

The cost of operating rail is easy to calculate. Too many independent agents to accurately price automobile GDP (for lack of a better word).

> is too slow for time-sensitive stuff

Not if you have more trains running more frequently. Its a case of induced demand[0]

0.https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Induced_demand#:~:text=Induced....

Re: U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

#335

Post by sbm_au »

14 wrote: post #201
starkparker wrote: post #161

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They're Kyburz DXP trikes, specially designed for Australia Post: https://www.kyburz-asia.com/delivery-vehicles/dxp-au 120kg load capacity (270kg with trailer), 50kph max speed, 50-100km range. Curb weight is 315kg, total vehicle weight is 510kg. For comparison, the USPS NGDV requirements were for a vehicle that could carry a loaded Kyburz DKP (minimum payload capacity of 680kg in 155 cubic ft) at twice the top speed…

Wow that is faster than I expected since they are 3 wheeled. Honda stopped producing 3 wheeled trikes because they were far too easy to tip over during cornering and many people died. These things look like they could do the same if not careful. I hope they give employees lots of training.

I can say they do give Australia Post riders lots of training.

I have a relative who did rider and driver training for learners. As well as the general public, they also ran Australia Post training courses which were large, regular, and took a lot of time.

Re: U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

#336

Post by prawn »

dbg31415 wrote: post #83
viraptor wrote: post #13

For comparison, Australia Post went with mostly 3-wheel electric bikes for local deliveries (3100 out of 4100 EVs in the fleet mid 2022). https://auspost.com.au/our-stories/inspiring-stories/sustain... there's a photo in the link. The low noise compared to the previous powered bikes is really nice.

Hard to fit Amazon packages on a tricycle, Mate.

The trikes deliver letters and small packages (padded envelopes, etc). The larger packages are delivered separately by a van.

Re: U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

#337

Post by [deleted] »

comboy wrote: post #299
euroderf wrote: post #240

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like this might be a case for solar panels on-board. Long delivery route, moderate speeds, open road.

From quick search electric car uses 0.15-0.2kWh per kilometer. That's amount of energy you get after delivering 200 Watts for an hour. Let's say you have 2m2 of roof (pretty generous), of very efficient panels in your driving in absolute optimal conditions when they are giving you full power (that's around 200W/m2). No loses on the inverter and such. So you need to be going at the speed of 2km/h. Well, that's actuall…

[deleted]

Re: U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

#338

Post by vanderZwan »

jonasdegendt wrote: post #320
mcv wrote: post #282

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dutch postal service PostNL has a wide variety of vehicles ranging from trucks to bicycles. And as far as I know, bicycles have always been a big part of the last few miles of mail delivery here. https://www.postnl.nl/over-postnl/pers-nieuws/beeldmateriaal...

They have all these vehicles but what's actually being used in practice in the Netherlands for last mile deliveries? I'm in the city center of a large Belgian city and 99% of my deliveries from both BPost and PostNL are still the regular white panel vans, even though both have local sorting centers.

Well, I can't find any numbers on that right now (although I'm sure they're on-line somewhere) but where my family lives in the Netherlands it's mostly bikes. One of my sister delivers mail on one too.

Perhaps the policy is different in Belgium?

Re: U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

#339

Post by psychlops »

manquer wrote: post #141
PaulDavisThe1st wrote: post #91

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Because there are people doing things out there that are valuable to us, but we don't pay them enough to do those things that they could dream of paying the full cost of mail delivery.

Shouldn’t we be instead paying them the fair value of their labor rather than this and let them choose how to spend that money ? We tried subsidizing rural broadband for last 3 decades with 100s of billions of dollars with little to show for it , Starlink on the other hand is able to solve it with purely commercial enterprise not withstanding the small rural subsidy they got. Maybe it is better for the market to deci…

> Maybe it is better for the market to decide ?

It is better for the market to decide. Otherwise you will have some small percentage of people who have excellent reasons why their particular area should receive a disproportionate amount of money.

Re: U.S. Postal Service starts nationwide electric vehicle fleet, buying 9,250 EVs

#340

Post by jillesvangurp »

akira2501 wrote: post #61
photochemsyn wrote: post #32

This will save a lot of money over time. Last time I checked in any detail, electricity prices per mile of transport per ton were about 25% that of fossil fuel prices per mile of transport per ton, and that was three years ago. They should really move all long-haul trucking to electric as well, at least for the main trunk lines, and for city-wide delivery. Remote rural routes will likely be the hardest to electrify.

> electricity prices per mile of transport per ton were about 25% that of fossil fuel prices per mile of transport per ton In shipping and logistics, time is money. Fuel can be dispensed in the US at a maximum of 10 gal/minute. Factor that against the largest charger you can find and see why the single cost difference doesn't matter yet. > They should really move all long-haul trucking to electric as well Reduced cap…

Fuel is money as well. Recent diesel price inflation caused a lot of misery for truckers. A full tank of fuel costs way more than a typical trucker earns per day. And most truckers own their trucks and are under heavy debt. 600 gallons is a lot for a truck. Depending on where you get your diesel, you are going to pay 2-3 dollars per gallon at least. Closer to 5 in some places. So even a "modest" 150 gallon tank could set you back close to a 800$.

Recent price fluctuations due to the rise in oil prices have hit that sector really hard.

How many truckers will answer the question "would you like to save more in fuel cost per day than you currently earn per day?" with a "no?. Time loss for charging is maybe inconvenient but the price tag isn't that high for everyone.

Anyway, this stops being optional pretty soon after electrical trucks start undercutting transport prices because they simply have lower cost of course. But while there is still a choice, there are going to be smart truckers and broke truckers. They'll pay the difference out of their own pocket.

In any case, if the vehicle charges at night and has enough charge for the route, there is no time loss.

We're talking mail delivery here not trucking. They are not doing hundreds of miles per day. More like tens. With lots of drive a little, idle, drive a little, etc. driving. This has very poor fuel economy with an ice vehicle. An EV essentially has no energy cost when it is idling. At best you lose some energy to keep the AC and the radio going. Which isn't free with an ice vehicle either.

Mail and package deliveries are an ideal use case for EVs. Most commercial delivery companies have largely completed their move to EVs for this reason and are rolling out EVs as fast as they can get their hands on them. That debate is over and there never was much of a debate beyond "Would you like to cut cost? Yes!". Ancient history, the industry has moved on and the answer was conclusive. If you want to compete in that sector, EV is the only way. There's no case left for ice vehicles in that sector.

Trucking will follow.

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