This was considered "fake news" and heavily reprimanded all throughout the pandemic in the media attached to the Western consensus, hilarious how they're starting to do a 180 on it (next is doing a 360, I guess).
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Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says
211–220 of 1001 posts
Re: Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says
#212Earlier quoted context omitted.
You're commenting on a report that the (US Government's) DoE is saying it was lab leaked , so... the US isn't actively supporting any cover up, or they're doing a profoundly terrible job.
Just to clarify, because the nuance is getting lost, they are not suggesting it was lab made. A naturally occurring virus can be studied and then accidentally leaked from a lab. But yes, there's no indication that the US is trying to cover anything up. And China is secretive about all sorts of things, they're an authoritarian government.
Good point I will edit.
Re: Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says
#213Nothing seems certain at this point, but, let’s say the pandemic was actually caused by a lab leak. That’ll mean the world was brought to an economic standstill and millions of people died because of the errors and carelessness of some people…will there be consequences? What will be the assurance that such deadly mistake won’t occur again? If it was actually a lab leak, then it’ll definitely rank as the most costly a…
The only reason to not say it was a lab leak is to avoid embarrassing those responsible, China first and America second. But little by little people will start accepting that. What should the consequences be? At the very least a tightening of the controls around labs doing bio research. Of course, this amounts to nothing if someone is allowed to outsource research to labs in countries that don't follow the stringent…
> China first and America second.
wtf????????????? I have no idea what you are on about
Re: Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says
#214Earlier quoted context omitted.
Where do you people get briefed? The guy was fucking President
I love this reaction, because Trump, of all people, was getting some of the least useful briefings of any modern US president, due to his inability to pay attention.[0][1][2] So it's entirely possible that just watching the news casually would leave you better informed than the US president during the years of 2017 to 2021. [0] https://www.cnn.com/2021/11/29/politics/trump-intelligence-b... [1] https://www.theguardia…
No, it isn't entirely possible(any more than anything else is technically possible). In the rolling stone article:
> "Clapper agreed with Gistaro, telling Helgerson, “Trump doesn’t read much; he likes bullets.” Instead, during the Trump administration, the briefer would summarize aloud key points since the last briefing and provide three documents (none more than a page) about new developments abroad. This was all part of an effort to make the PDB “shorter and tighter, with declarative sentences and no feature-length pieces.”
> “Trump had his own way of receiving intelligence information—and a uniquely rough way of dealing publicly with the IC,” Helgerson wrote, “but it was a system in which he digested the key points offered by the briefers, asked questions, engaged in discussion, made his own priority interests known, and used the information as a basis for discussions with his policy advisers.”"
> "These and other difficulties agencies encountered under Trump led Helgerson to conclude that, “The system worked, but it struggled.”"
He clearly had access to more information than any civilian, and was engaging with it.
Re: Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says
#215IMO, it seems obvious from the behavior of China's government that they know it is a lab leak. If it wasn't a lab leak, then presumably there is an animal reservoir of the virus somewhere in China, but as far as I know they haven't claimed to have found it. But if there is an animal reservoir of the virus in China, then how could the Chinese government ever expect a lockdown to work? A lockdown on travel would only r…
Lockdowns serve a purpose: to slow the spread of the virus.
Re: Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says
#216The This Week In Virology podcast has been talking about the lab leak concept since the early days of the pandemic, with various experts opining on the likelihood. In [1], the expert discusses how the virus itself does not seem engineered; it’s most likely a naturally created virus. However, this is exactly the sort of virus that they study at the BSL4 lab in Wuhan, quite legitimately - and they produce good science…
> However, this is exactly the sort of virus that they study at the BSL4 lab in Wuhan No it isn't. The were studying SARS-CoV-1 and WIV-1. They sequenced RaTG13 but that is too far away from SARS-CoV-2 with a thousand random mutations across its genome. And there's no evidence that they ever recovered culturable virus from RaTG13 or were able to culture it--there's a vast gap between sequencing a virus and culturing…
If you are not a native English speaker, you may want to know that you are pretty drastically misreading parents comment. He is not saying "I know this specific virus is present" but "the lab studied SARS related coronaviruses" which you in fact seem to agree with.
Re: Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says
#217The This Week In Virology podcast has been talking about the lab leak concept since the early days of the pandemic, with various experts opining on the likelihood. In [1], the expert discusses how the virus itself does not seem engineered; it’s most likely a naturally created virus. However, this is exactly the sort of virus that they study at the BSL4 lab in Wuhan, quite legitimately - and they produce good science…
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> why does the US actively support this cover up?
Sometimes, answers are more clear when questions are more clear.
“Why is the US waiting to secure a convincing case that produces useful diplomatic leverage instead of indulging public speculation by making an early call that wastes the opportunity?”
There’s a lot to lose by making a case that other nations can dismiss, and a lot to gain by having a case that they can’t. If there was a culpable lab leak, the game comes down to China making it easy for its partners to plausibly deny while others try to collect thorough enough evidence that they can’t. The tidbits that feed conspiracy circles might be 100% right and very convincing to individuals, but are too thin to put world leaders on the spot. For now.
Re: Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says
#218The lab leak hypothesis makes the most sense. The lab in Wuhan which researches coronaviruses conducts experiences on animals, including bats. Like other labs, there are dedicated personnel for hydrating and feeding the experimental animals. Notably, there are "wet markets" in Wuhan where live animals are sold, including bats, which harbor coronaviruses. Someone who is working in the facility in charge of maintenance…
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Re: Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says
#219There's a lot of bad headline-writing on this subject today. Here's the NYT's headline: Lab Leak Most Likely Caused Pandemic, Energy Dept. Says And then the sub-head (or dek, if you want to sound like you're in the know): The conclusion, which was made with “low confidence,” came as America’s intelligence agencies remained divided over the origins of the coronavirus. So we have a conclusion: 'lab leak most likely cau…
What is the substantive difference between "Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says" and "Lab Leak Most Likely Caused Pandemic, Energy Dept. Says"? The only difference I see is that one notes the pandemic ("Covid-19") while the other notes the agency ("Energy Dept."). Or is your comment more broadly that both headlines are bad? If so, then I'd disagree. Both headlines give the most impo…
I think the criticism is that saying something is ‘most likely’ implies a sense of it being pretty likely. When the reality is that they are very uncertain.
Both headlines are clickbait compared to the content of the article.
Re: Lab leak most likely origin of Covid-19 pandemic, U.S. agency now says
#220There's a lot of bad headline-writing on this subject today. Here's the NYT's headline: Lab Leak Most Likely Caused Pandemic, Energy Dept. Says And then the sub-head (or dek, if you want to sound like you're in the know): The conclusion, which was made with “low confidence,” came as America’s intelligence agencies remained divided over the origins of the coronavirus. So we have a conclusion: 'lab leak most likely cau…
Also article mentions FBI has “moderate” confidence it was lab leak. I find that very interesting given it wouldn’t be so much based on scientific analysis but some intelligence collection the FBI has.
Science is the collecting and processing of empirical data using peer reviewed methods to reach a conclusion. Which part do you think the FBI is not doing which separates their process from science?