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Learn Vim (2021)

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Re: Learn Vim (2021)

#81

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://github.com/helix-editor/helix is the answer mate

I'm happy to dump NeoVim if Helix is actually better. But is the ecosystem _really_ there yet?

No neovim is much better and easier and retains most of the vi keystrokes while helix breaks some common vi keystrokes

And no extension interface for helix another big positive for neovim and even vi

Re: Learn Vim (2021)

#82

I can handle basic editing in vim and I have given real tries to use it as my main text editor but I just cannot find a way to get as comfortable in vim as I can in VS Code.

Ironically I'm more comfortable in VS once I found the VI plugin ;)

Re: Learn Vim (2021)

#83
post #12

I defaulted to Nano when I picked up linux, and that unfortunate choice has bitten me in the butt.

I learned vim when I picked up linux, now I work at a company with a customized emacs tool we have to use. Doh it never ends...

What does the customized emacs tool do? It sounds interesting.

Re: Learn Vim (2021)

#84

I dunno, I never sat down to learn vim, just used it every day for a couple years. I’m not one of those wizards who is, like, answering stack overflow questions or writing wiki articles, but I get the job done. Is it necessary to learn Vim? Seems like a chore. Is the text editor really a bottleneck for anyone? I find that no matter how slow I type, I need to spend more time thinking of what to type anyway, if I’m doi…

I'm insatiably interested in most technology but learned vi and vim commands largely through typos.

Re: Learn Vim (2021)

#85

It's kind of weird to read about "learning" VIM, at least from someone who's been using it (er VI) for 40 years. It's nuts, but if asked, I don't even know how to do certain things in VI; I just do them. Ask me what keys to press to go up, or down, or right or left? I dunno - I just do it. Yea it's nuts. It's like baby duckling bonding - the first editor mindset (aka EMACS vs VI) you use, you just bond to and it just…

Same here. I remember vi commands as finger movements on the keyboard. Example formatting a block of text is !}fmt but I can't remember it except as a sequence of key presses. It was hard even to get the actual sequence of characters for this comment.

edit: clarity

Re: Learn Vim (2021)

#86
post #58

No one should be learning Vimscript at this point. That language should have died a long time ago. A new user coming to the Vim ecosystem in 2023 would be best served by using Neovim with Lua.

Vim now has vim9 script which is fully integrated and is actually very pleasant to use. It’s like a watered down TypeScript.

Re: Learn Vim (2021)

#88

I dunno, I never sat down to learn vim, just used it every day for a couple years. I’m not one of those wizards who is, like, answering stack overflow questions or writing wiki articles, but I get the job done. Is it necessary to learn Vim? Seems like a chore. Is the text editor really a bottleneck for anyone? I find that no matter how slow I type, I need to spend more time thinking of what to type anyway, if I’m doi…

Yeah I think vim style modal editing is really useful, but honestly I get about 70% of the value from doing it "wrong"; using a fast key repeat and holding down hjkl, using visual mode a lot, etc.

It really doesn't need to be this mystical uber-hacker thing to be useful.

Re: Learn Vim (2021)

#89

It's kind of weird to read about "learning" VIM, at least from someone who's been using it (er VI) for 40 years. It's nuts, but if asked, I don't even know how to do certain things in VI; I just do them. Ask me what keys to press to go up, or down, or right or left? I dunno - I just do it. Yea it's nuts. It's like baby duckling bonding - the first editor mindset (aka EMACS vs VI) you use, you just bond to and it just…

My vim history is much like yours. I’ve tried to learn more about its features but unless they made their way into my daily workflow immediately, I just as easily forget them. Finally, I threw in the towel and decided I knew enough to get my work done and stopped.

Re: Learn Vim (2021)

#90

I dunno, I never sat down to learn vim, just used it every day for a couple years. I’m not one of those wizards who is, like, answering stack overflow questions or writing wiki articles, but I get the job done. Is it necessary to learn Vim? Seems like a chore. Is the text editor really a bottleneck for anyone? I find that no matter how slow I type, I need to spend more time thinking of what to type anyway, if I’m doi…

I don't understand this attitude. It's clearly more conducive to solving problems to be able to move around our environment more quickly. It's extremely useful (compared to a beginner who only knows insert and write quit) to understand the different vim modalities as well as a few commands to jump around a file or to perform regex or to call an external command. When you're not proficient with the necessary tools, yo…

I wrote a comment agreeing with your parent comment, but this probably applies to me:

> I hear this sort of opinion most eagerly expressed by engineers who in fact are quite handy with vim!

But to me, that makes me think that you should wonder whether there's something to that. For me, you're right, I did get really handy with vim at one point. After I had been using it to a very basic level for two or three years, I felt kind of sheepish and guilty and endeavored to learn it properly. So I bought into doing it "right" for awhile, wrote a bunch of custom script to customize it, the whole shebang. And my conclusion after that was that it wasn't really worth it. I went back to just using the basic stuff. This is also, importantly, supported in every IDE's keybindings, so I can use modal navigation and editing anywhere without needing to customize anything, which is pretty great.

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