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Jonathan Coulton on MegaUpload and piracy

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Re: Jonathan Coulton on MegaUpload and piracy

#41
So let's see - your legal stuff stored on an online service... or even broader, you contract some service you need out to a company. That company gets it's doors slammed because they landed in legal trouble - who cares who's fault that was, that's not your problem - your immediate problem is you no longer have access to that service.

I've seen a bank go bankrupt and people lose quite a bit of money. (no, not in the US, no FDIC, etc etc, private bank, other country). Imagine hitting the ATM on the way to work and finding out that the bank is simply gone. Okay, the US has good protections against that, as do most 1st world nations..... but the lesson coming out of that was "Hmm, maybe we should look at only using government sanctioned banks with, you know, insurance, and if it's going to be a private bank, I want to know more about their financial situation before committing to them. Lesson learned.

Security company for the condo complex got shut down because they broke immigration laws. Left the condo with no security, even though most of the staff were legal, it didn't matter. Those guys are out jobs, and the condo has to have an emergency meeting to figure out how to get back good, trustworthy guards again. Suppliers go bankrupt. Heck, people get sick, family emergencies, they die unexpectedly and unfortunately, leaving you with a problem.

So let's not blow it up into more than it is. If the lawmakers were way out of line here, let's make sure it comes out and they are sanctioned appropriately.... but regardless, it's a 3rd party service. If you're using any critical service that is devastating to be without, you need to properly assess and address that risk.... whether it's data or services, staff or insurance, etc.

Re: Jonathan Coulton on MegaUpload and piracy

#42
post #20
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have a nice story, too. Just the other day my Macbook died; "green light of death", i.e. it's not charging and not turning on anymore (presumably the battery is dead). On the harddrive of said Macbook I have ~$300 worth of purchased iTunes movies that I cannot access anymore. I had never bothered to back them up because I was under the naive assumption I could just re-download them when needed. A service that I too…

This is news to me. When looking at an iPad recently the guy in the Apple store told me that anything I bought on iTunes could be moved to a new device should I ever upgrade. So long as I have the same AppleId (email?) What else is non-transferable? Books? Music? Apps? (Can iDevices do other things?)

You can redownload: music, apps, books, TV shows. Movies aren't in that list. Also, you might not be able to redownload something if it's been taken off the store.

http://www.apple.com/icloud/features/

Re: Jonathan Coulton on MegaUpload and piracy

#43
post #21
post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

is that really a problem with itunes? if your house burned down, you'd lose all of the movies you had on DVD. at least with itunes movies, you can legally make backups of the files.

Well, I'll flat out admit that I'm an idiot. I should have read the fine-print, they surely did tell me somewhere that I'm not allowed to re-download m̶y̶ their movies. But then again. It's 2012. Is it really such an outrageous assumption that I'd be able to re-download digital content that I paid dearly for? Steam lets me re-download my games as often as I want. Amazon and all ebook vendors let me re-download my boo…

For a reasonable but not specifically informed consumer, I think it's likely they expect to be able to re-download movies from iTunes, particularly since music, apps, etc. can be re-downloaded.

In the US, tends to err on the side of consumer protection, even in the face of a click-through license to the contrary. While Apple will let you re-download if you call (apparently), if I'd lost >$100 in iTunes movies and they wouldn't, I'd call AmEx and charge back the purchase. Or go to small claims, just for the novelty of winning against Apple.

However, I just pirate music, tv, and movies shamelessly (and buy Blu-Ray physical media, since I like 1080p, and rip). MPAA and RIAA declared war on everyone else about 15 years ago, so fuck them. The only reason I pay is for convenience.

Re: Jonathan Coulton on MegaUpload and piracy

#44
post #10

I just heard his piece on NPR's Marketplace. I thought he came across well, and the reporter put the tweet in the proper context.

Wow, just listened to it. He really nailed the subject in those 5 minutes. He said a lot of the things it seemed like Alexis Ohanian wanted to say in his debates.

Re: Jonathan Coulton on MegaUpload and piracy

#45

Hmm, isn't Jonathan's blog post just an advertisement for a few e-commerce links on his website - catering to anti-SOPA-crazed technologists that will upvote this post and buy his songs while they're there? Anyway, people don't change overnight. Once you train people they can find pirated content for free, they'll continue doing this - and it's very hard to compete with a torrent search site.

Is it just that? It doesn't look like it. Does it serve as an advertisement for his work? Yes, and there's nothing wrong with that.

Re: Jonathan Coulton on MegaUpload and piracy

#46
post #39

This whole post is a red herring. Megaupload was also used for legal activities. Awesome. I bet the mafia also did some stuff that was legal. Let's consider the "complexity" this introduces into the act of putting mobsters in jail. Insightful. Piracy is victimless. So is me breaking into your house while you're not home, watching TV for a while, and then leaving. I mean, you're not even using your TV while you're not…

"This whole post is a red herring."

I don't understand how you can say that. What is this "red herring" truly hiding? Jonathan Coulton has always been outspoken about piracy in this regard.

Your comparison of piracy to breaking and entering is really outlandish.

Re: Jonathan Coulton on MegaUpload and piracy

#47

Hmm, isn't Jonathan's blog post just an advertisement for a few e-commerce links on his website - catering to anti-SOPA-crazed technologists that will upvote this post and buy his songs while they're there? Anyway, people don't change overnight. Once you train people they can find pirated content for free, they'll continue doing this - and it's very hard to compete with a torrent search site.

For as long as I've been following his blog, he's used it to talk about things he wants to talk about. If he's touring, he'll likely post about touring. Lately he's been organizing a cruise, and he's been talking about that. He also just released an album -- I don't think it's unfair that he post about that on his blog.

I have seen examples of people attempting to "cash-in" on the SOPA outcry, but I do not believe Jonathan Coulton is one of those people.

Re: Jonathan Coulton on MegaUpload and piracy

#49
post #37
post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well no, the alternative is to not work at all. And I know plenty of people (heh, Berkeley) who get along fine without working. Some of them are probably happier than plenty of employed people. I know this isn't strictly relevant, but I really believe that thanks to technology improvements, we need to work on dispelling the idea that everybody has to work. Unemployment should gradually stop being a horrible fate wort…

I love this topic, because you always have to take the side of those that ARE working and end up having to distribute the fruits of their labors to the non working. Until we get self sufficient factory farms and power plants (so let us think futuristic here, say 50 years) where robots generate carbon through some means, pattern it into amino acids, and use 3d printing technology to generate plant and muscle matter th…

I do not think everything needs to be automated. Rather, we just need to reach a certain level of efficiency: as soon as one person can produce enough of something for, say, several thousand--something completely reasonable with today's technology--you start reaching the point where you do not need everybody working.

Just because your power plant employs some people--and it probably really is just a handful--does not mean everybody has to work. The same is true for agriculture; one farmer is already extremely effective, and with the advent of cheap robotics[1] they are poised to become more efficient yet.

[1]: Something like: http://www.harvestai.com/

"Whom to pay" is a loaded question--we have already reached, or are rapidly reaching, a point where society can exist happily without everybody pitching in. Why should anybody's saying their creation powers things actually matter?

Of course, my argument isn't really about getting rid of payment or even the capitalistic system. Rather, it is about extending a recent trend: the increasing minimum standard of living. In a perfect world, you would be able to subsist comfortably without working. Of course, there are plenty of other ways to motivate people: status, luxury items...etc.

So, given increases in efficiency and different sources of motivation, I do not see why a capitalist society with plenty of people not working is impossible. Now, I doubt transitioning there would be easy: too many people are emotionally set against freeloaders. If we actually needed everybody to work, this would be great; however, as technology progresses and this is needed less and less, it stops being great.

Of course, there is one glaring whole in my argument (or, at least, one I'm pointing out): we may not be at the requisite level of efficiency yet. However, if recent trends continue, I thin we will reach it some time soon even if we are not there yet. And when we do--and well after--the cultural aversion to "freeloading" will persist even though it is less and less needed. Which is unfortunate.

Re: Jonathan Coulton on MegaUpload and piracy

#50
post #23
post #8

Brilliant, I agree with just about everything said in this post. There is no credible evidence that piracy actually damages artists, and plenty of empirical case studies where it greatly benefited them. It is horrendously disappointing to see the american government, supposedly the elected representation of the people, ignore all the scientific evidence produced and wholly adopt the viewpoint they are fed by a minisc…

The only thing I don't understand completely is his actual stance on copyright. He says he's okay with the notion, since he and many other artists benefit from it. But he quite clearly doesn't think piracy hurts artists, and doesn't seem to think that downloading poses a threat (or at least not enough of a threat to warrant taking down websites). I agree with the latter, but I'm not sure how Coulton finds the latter…

Copyrights is the same as creating a legal monopoly to a particular item/idea. Hence, from a pure economic perspective, it creates deadweightloss, or over all less for the economy. Hence assuming an efficient market, it is a VERY bad thing.

However, since we don't live in an efficient market, we have these things that prevents anybody from creating things called the barrier to entry. This could be startup capital, facilities, or whatever that is needed to manufacture and distribute the items. This prevents anybody from just making a movie, since you would need all the equipment and crew to shoot it. Copyright basically guarantees a limited monopoly for the creators to give them a reduction in risk involved in creating the item.

But the bottom line is, copyright is not a good thing, and it is only as good as the barrier to entry is. With the barrier to entry for making creative media so much lower than what it was before (anybody can record an album using Garageband), the reduction of risk, in the form of copyright, might not justify the overall loss created by the deadweightloss. Essentially it is a comparison of deadweightloss vs opportunity cost of not having the idea ever created. And in the current time, because the opportunity cost is so small, copyright laws should adjust itself, which it hasn't.

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