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Signal would 'walk' from UK if Online Safety Bill undermined encryption

bbc.com

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Re: Signal would 'walk' from UK if Online Safety Bill undermined encryption

#61

Post by WithinReason »

madaxe_again wrote: post #51
DeusExMachina wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I honestly don’t understand what this “crypto thing” you mention is or has any relevance with the discussion. I use Signal every day to communicate with my friends. None of them is a software developer or a technical person. If you are not the target audience of Signal, it does not mean that nobody else is.

I believe he’s referring to this. https://mobilecoin.com/ https://support.signal.org/hc/en-us/articles/360057625692-In...

Ironically, to actually use this and obtain mobilecoins you need to go through KYC and provide detailed personal information from your name to your great-grandmother's blood group

Re: Signal would 'walk' from UK if Online Safety Bill undermined encryption

#62

Post by nhchris »

jossclimb wrote: post #15

> The government, and prominent child protection charities have long argued that encryption hinders efforts to combat online child abuse - which they say is a growing problem. So take using a sledgehammer to crack a nut. What they should be doing, is rather then increase the risk of for the majority who use encryption for valid reasons (privacy, not nefarious), is invest in services to allow individuals to gain help,…

> encryption hinders efforts to combat online child abuse

So do opaque walls and the absence of surveillance cameras in cars and homes. Oh don't worry - the recordings will be securely stored, and only available with a court order, only issued for "serious" crime!

It's strange that as surveillance proliferates, the shrinking scraps of privacy we have left are deemed a growing problem, not a vanishing one.

Re: Signal would 'walk' from UK if Online Safety Bill undermined encryption

#63

Post by d3nj4l »

ta1243 wrote: post #45
sph wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The "children" excuse + most of the population saying "I don't need privacy, I have nothing to hide" is a double whammy against any form of encryption and it's just a matter of time before our Internet privacy rights are completely stripped away. A huge educational campaign is necessary to convince people and the average politician that being pro-encryption doesn't mean being criminals or pedophiles. So it's a lost b…

Easy to frame a headline against it. "New bill to allow Jeremy Corbyn to read your secret messages and Tories WONT FIGHT IT"

The poor man’s not even in labour anymore, let him rest!

Re: Signal would 'walk' from UK if Online Safety Bill undermined encryption

#64

Post by WithinReason »

Symbiote wrote: post #56
hunglee2 wrote: post #8

incredible if UK were to ban Signal, but I guess national sovereignty and security are always going to be higher priorities for the state than user sentiment

It was widely reported that the Conservative party moved their internal communications to Signal in 2019. I wonder if they still use it?

If yes, I hope that means the bill is unlikely to pass

Re: Signal would 'walk' from UK if Online Safety Bill undermined encryption

#66

Post by jojobas »

cnity wrote: post #25
jossclimb wrote: post #15

> The government, and prominent child protection charities have long argued that encryption hinders efforts to combat online child abuse - which they say is a growing problem. So take using a sledgehammer to crack a nut. What they should be doing, is rather then increase the risk of for the majority who use encryption for valid reasons (privacy, not nefarious), is invest in services to allow individuals to gain help,…

Make no mistake: the Online Safety Bill has absolutely nothing to do with protecting children. End-to-end encryption is the first line of defence against government approved mass surveillance. If it falls, the rest will follow. It will only be a short period until the operation is expanded under the guise of additional "protections" against the citizens.

[flagged]

Re: Signal would 'walk' from UK if Online Safety Bill undermined encryption

#67

Post by askvictor »

nicce wrote: post #37
fauigerzigerk wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You have to consider how this would happen. If the government bans E2EE, Apple and Google will have to ban E2EE from their UK stores. Apps like Signal will then have to make a choice. Either publish an app that does not use E2EE or get removed from the app stores. What Signal are saying is that they would accept the ban rather than publish an app with weakened encryption. Apple users will not be able to make their ow…

> Apple users will not be able to make their own choice. Android users will be able to make their own choice thanks to side-loading Recent update on WebKit about PWA, however, makes anything possible now on iOS devices. https://webkit.org/blog/13878/web-push-for-web-apps-on-ios-a... Technically you need browser anymore to run proper messaging apps.

There are problems with using a browser for delivery of any secure elements. It's slightly better than nothing, but if the govt can coerce Apple into blocking Signal from the app store, then they can coerce Apple into compromising their browser to deliver a modified Signal web-app for certain people.

Re: Signal would 'walk' from UK if Online Safety Bill undermined encryption

#68

Post by notpushkin »

Arathorn wrote: post #47
fmajid wrote: post #44

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It is dual French and British. That said, France's record on freedom of encryption is not that stellar either, even if it is not as bad an enemy of the Internet at the UK. Element should preemptively move its HQ to Iceland or similar.

Element was founded as half French/British, but we also have German & US legal entities now, and we will shift our HQ out of the UK if forced to.

That is reassuring, thank you!

Have you considered moving the HQ to some more privacy-friendly place? (Switzerland would be an obvious choice, but I've heard good things about Seychelles too, for example.)

Re: Signal would 'walk' from UK if Online Safety Bill undermined encryption

#69

Post by daveoc64 »

jojobas wrote: post #66
cnity wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Make no mistake: the Online Safety Bill has absolutely nothing to do with protecting children. End-to-end encryption is the first line of defence against government approved mass surveillance. If it falls, the rest will follow. It will only be a short period until the operation is expanded under the guise of additional "protections" against the citizens.

[flagged]

You'll find very few people in the UK that want to be able to have weapons in the way that the USA does.
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