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Google search for a local restaurant returns scammer’s ad as top result

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Re: Google search for a local restaurant returns scammer’s ad as top result

#91

Post by izacus »

hnbad wrote: post #53
izacus wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both. It can be both. Compare to food: it's like demanding that Walmart screen all the food itself to protect you and then you'd screech at Walmart and only Walmart for not making sure Keloggs cereal is healthy while letting the manufacturer off the hook with zero (I repeat, zero, none, null, NADA) consequences for fraud and damage they caused. The way media, HNers and other people behave is creating a situation that…

Except Walmart has to follow certain standards to ensure the products it sells are legitimate. If they'd literally just accept products from random unmarked vans and put them up for sale, they'd be very much on the line if those products end up being unsafe. Likewise you can't just sell stolen goods even if you don't know they're stolen. They'll be confiscated at best and you'll be charged for fencing stolen goods at…

Exactly. Where are those standards for software and content?

Remember that we punish the companies that build products against standards first, not just Walmart for stocking them. We also don't trust exclusively just Walmart to set and enforce food safety standards (because that would be problematic for competition wouldn't it)? We have independent standard bodies.

And right know we have NOTHING to beat Google (or Apple or anyone) on the head with because there's no standard or rule they've ignored when they allowed this ad to be published.

Re: Google search for a local restaurant returns scammer’s ad as top result

#92

Post by phkahler »

hnbad wrote: post #53
izacus wrote: post #37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Both. It can be both. Compare to food: it's like demanding that Walmart screen all the food itself to protect you and then you'd screech at Walmart and only Walmart for not making sure Keloggs cereal is healthy while letting the manufacturer off the hook with zero (I repeat, zero, none, null, NADA) consequences for fraud and damage they caused. The way media, HNers and other people behave is creating a situation that…

Except Walmart has to follow certain standards to ensure the products it sells are legitimate. If they'd literally just accept products from random unmarked vans and put them up for sale, they'd be very much on the line if those products end up being unsafe. Likewise you can't just sell stolen goods even if you don't know they're stolen. They'll be confiscated at best and you'll be charged for fencing stolen goods at…

>> Except Walmart has to follow certain standards to ensure the products it sells are legitimate.

And so Walmart makes a solid effort to ensure they know who they are buying product from.

Re: Google search for a local restaurant returns scammer’s ad as top result

#94

Post by specialist »

perihelions wrote: post #59

Simple legislative fix: entitle the victim (small business) to quickly and easily claim a trademark infringement on an ad, and claw back 100% of Google's revenue on that ad. And let Google be civilly liable, if they choose to contest such a trademark claim and they're in the wrong. Inspired by YouTube's DMCA claim system (or my superficial understanding of it). If there's a "bug bounty" on fraud, there will be an ent…

Any chance you have model legislation (for me to use)?

Two years ago, I got fluffed up about scammers claiming unclaimed businesses. Like the food delivery startups (like Doctorow mentions).

I started talking to my reps (city council, state) but haven't gotten any further. And I don't know where to start drafting the legislation.

With some sort of resolution or model legislation, I can shop it around, get the ball rolling. Like chamber of commerce, some scammed businesses, my representatives.

Thanks.

Re: Google search for a local restaurant returns scammer’s ad as top result

#95

Post by psychlops »

perihelions wrote: post #59

Simple legislative fix: entitle the victim (small business) to quickly and easily claim a trademark infringement on an ad, and claw back 100% of Google's revenue on that ad. And let Google be civilly liable, if they choose to contest such a trademark claim and they're in the wrong. Inspired by YouTube's DMCA claim system (or my superficial understanding of it). If there's a "bug bounty" on fraud, there will be an ent…

> If there's a "bug bounty" on fraud, there will be an enthusiastic market for identifying it.

Not to mention a cottage industry of creating then "solving" the ad fraud. I imagine Google's solution for this would be 100% Yelp.

Re: Google search for a local restaurant returns scammer’s ad as top result

#96

Post by jeffbee »

I’d like to know what the author or any of these commenters think the process would look like that would have actually stopped this advertiser. Some guy wants to advertise their Thai restaurant. They’ve got the domain name, the site is up, it works. What else is the ad marketplace supposed to check? It’s not like you can’t have the same name as another Thai restaurant. After all, the domain registrar gave them that name.

So what would it look like?

Re: Google search for a local restaurant returns scammer’s ad as top result

#97

Post by boomboomsubban »

tcmb wrote: post #78
antihero wrote: post #32

I’m just amazed Cory Doctorow of all people doesn’t use uBlock and got duped by this. I’ve always seen Google Ads as about as reliable as the fake download buttons on crappy file websites. You tune them out or block them.

Plot twist: Cory Doctorow gets paid by the restaurant to promote them. He then made the fake website and bought the Google ads in order to concoct this outrage story to go viral. I mean, if this is a "great Thai restaurant in my neighborhood", how likely is it he ordered there yesterday for the first time?

Do you have perfect recall of every restaurant's website? Even if you do, surely one of them changed their site at some point.

You're probably joking, but even if you do order from a place a couple times a year it can be hard to tell which site is theirs. A local restaurant for me at one point had two different websites, each featured different indoor pictures of the location and their food. I never knew if I should use the new one or the old one, with the problem being solved when they retired and the new owners renamed the place.

Re: Google search for a local restaurant returns scammer’s ad as top result

#98

Post by mcculley »

jeffbee wrote: post #96

I’d like to know what the author or any of these commenters think the process would look like that would have actually stopped this advertiser. Some guy wants to advertise their Thai restaurant. They’ve got the domain name, the site is up, it works. What else is the ad marketplace supposed to check? It’s not like you can’t have the same name as another Thai restaurant. After all, the domain registrar gave them that n…

If my paid ad for my restaurant is right above the organic search result, how is Google adding any value?

Re: Google search for a local restaurant returns scammer’s ad as top result

#99

Post by jeffbee »

mcculley wrote: post #98
jeffbee wrote: post #96

I’d like to know what the author or any of these commenters think the process would look like that would have actually stopped this advertiser. Some guy wants to advertise their Thai restaurant. They’ve got the domain name, the site is up, it works. What else is the ad marketplace supposed to check? It’s not like you can’t have the same name as another Thai restaurant. After all, the domain registrar gave them that n…

If my paid ad for my restaurant is right above the organic search result, how is Google adding any value?

Hypothetically? You just recently moved your site to a new domain name (your reasons are your own) and you want to advertise the new one even though the old one is “organically” first.

You want to control the snippet in a way that’s impossible with organic search.

Among other hypothetical situations.

Re: Google search for a local restaurant returns scammer’s ad as top result

#100

Post by int_19h »

joemi wrote: post #11

The most surprising thing about this is that someone as internet-savvy as Doctorow doesn't just skip over the ads but instead clicks on them. That's just asking for trouble.

Google very intentionally made ads to look like a part of the search results. The reason why we know this is intentional is because it wasn't always like that.
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