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Mercedes-Benz previews its operating system MB.OS

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Re: Mercedes-Benz previews its operating system MB.OS

#151
post #103
post #33

Everyones talking about alot of negatives. But I have a E53 AMG 4matic+ coup. It looks amazing, like constant compliments, i've even had people compliment it and give me their number in a wendy's drive through. But the OS(MBUX 2) is actually really good, at first I was a bit negative on it. But the way they have everything integrated that isn't really possible with apple play is nice. The dash is customizable, I have…

I'm blown away you think "[women] give me their number" is like... something we ought to know about using the home grown Merc infotainment system? Like that's a feature I look for in my vehicle onboard computer, a "propensity for women to want to date me while I order fast food" metric. So many questions. So many.

The infotainment and lighting + other controls really sells it…

I more meant that even from a style standpoint, I never had that happen when I drove a Honda. There’s also features like making the engine “purr” which works really well on dates. There’s just a lot of integrated features they can control, to the point that not only is it useable and I like it better than CarPlay. It also has tangible benefits and genuinely helps me score. With features that wouldn’t be possible with a CarPlay based os and not having everything super integrated.

Re: Mercedes-Benz previews its operating system MB.OS

#152
I just found this presentation with technical details: https://group.mercedes-benz.com/dokumente/investoren/praesen...

I guess it is not a typical OS, but more like a collection of tools that build on already existing OSs. This is comparable to ROS (Robotic Operating System), which are just some programs, middleware, services and conventions to build software for robots on Linux.

It seems like this should integrate and abstract different "OS" (Linux, QNX, AUTOSAR) and run on very different platforms (high power application processor for infotaiment, microcontrollers) (Slide 13). These are widely different systems:

1. Linux needs a Memory Managing Unit (MMU), which only comes with high(ish) powered application processors, e.g. Arm Cortex-A9. These are obviously not hard-realtime because a page fault can occur non-deterministically (except when you can lock everything to RAM). This might be used for infotaiment.

2. (Classic) AUTOSAR is used without a operating system on a microcontroller like the ARM Cortex-M or a automotive MCU like the Infinion TriCore, which can run two cores in lockstep to verify each computation. AUTOSAR is kind of the operating system and you buy an "adaption"/HAL of AUTOSAR to the each MCU from a vendor. This is widely used in many ECUs for hard real-time control, e.g. to control something in the engine, and other stuff like the electric windows. AUTOSAR is a huge pain in the ass to develop for. You usually configure "it", which takes a lot of time. Then a software generates a huge amount of code. The software is from another vendor, e.g. Vector or Elektrobit. The developer fills out the function stubs implementing the actual function. Alternatively, you can generate the code from MATLAB/SIMULINK models with a code generator from yet another vendor (model-based-development). The upside of this, that the HAL and code generators are certified and everything is somehow standardized. The downside is that normal developers want to kill themself, you learn no transferable skills, and the huge amount of generated boilerplate code, that is hard to read.

3. There is also a newer Adaptive AUTOSAR, which can run on Linux or QNX.

I guess (page 8) they want to use it for infotaiment (point 1), interior control (lights, climate control; probably point 2), automated driving and "central driving" (point 1, point 2). I am not sure if this includes typical fast hard-real-time tasks like engine control or chassis control (=vehicle dynamics control).

I am not sure if really want to abstract it all or just extend the "OS" (Linux, QNX, AUTOSAR) with libraries and components, mostly in user space.

If you look at slide 13, you might guess that they will adapt Linux and QNX to run their UI MBUX (in QT). They extend it with services that communicate with ECUs in the car and their servies in the internet. Moreover, they allow to install sandboxed apps from Mercedes, Android Auto (e.g. Spotify) on top of it. They also come with an app store: https://faurecia-aptoide.com/

The real-time ECUs in the car running AUTOSAR will just get additional components to easily communicate with other MB.OS parts and support some newer features like OTA update.

I have not seen any details how this relates to ADAS functions. These are typically (partially) run on a compute node made by an automotive supplier with a hardware accelerator from NVIDIA, e.g. ZF ProAI (https://www.zf.com/products/en/cars/products_64166.html) or from Valeo (https://www.valeo.com/en/domain-controller/).

Re: Mercedes-Benz previews its operating system MB.OS

#153
post #149

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm hoping thats what the "apple car" project actually is. Mobile devices are getting very, very powerful. I would love for my phone to handle all the processing for my car in the future.

You would love your brakes to depend on a USB or Bluetooth connection?

Anything that doesn't require the processing power can and should still run on the car, brake by wire is totally fine. I just don't mind if my phone has access to a few more sensors here and there, having CarPlay tell me if my tire pressures are low or being able to adjust my EV's profiles from the CarPlay UI would be nice.

Re: Mercedes-Benz previews its operating system MB.OS

#154
post #5

I was recently an owner of a Merced-Benz commercial van, and the software was by far the worst part of that whole experience. It had obvious race-condition type bugs when it came to the user interface layer, but most frustrating was its tendency to succumb to some kind of memory leak on long drives where the entire head unit would just lock up and crash to a black screen after 6-7 hours of being turned on. Because th…

Beware of Sprinters: they contain Dodgy parts.

Re: Mercedes-Benz previews its operating system MB.OS

#155
post #82

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I put a quad-lock on my dashboard and just stick my phone on it. It's right next to my steering wheel. I set the stereo to bluetooth link and everything's actually great. I think CarPlay and Auto are too much. Outside of navigation and music, what overlap do we have in a car and phone? Just enable bluetooth sending of locations or full-on directions. Bluetooth music already works great. Eventually we'll have voice ag…

Totally valid. What's a quad-lock? is that some sort of phone mount?

Yeah it's a special connector with phone cases and mounts for cars and motorcycles. Works great

Re: Mercedes-Benz previews its operating system MB.OS

#157
post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I’m also horrified by the trend to put more and more of the meters into the UI. My Ford has done the booting thing before on a highway as well as once it flipped the screen horizontally until it was shut down and started again. I can’t imagine the quality is any better for the display components that will replace speedometers and such

My (admittedly-beloved) 2015 F-150 will reboot Sync if I'm listening to music (usually on Soundcloud) if the song title includes non-ASCII characters.

I'm reminded of: ( https://99percentinvisible.org/episode/the-roman-mars-mazda-... ) the Mazda head unit being allergic to Roman Mars.

Re: Mercedes-Benz previews its operating system MB.OS

#159
post #106
post #54

A friend just bought a Mustang and showed it off. The driver's dashboard is a somewhat configurable screen. All I could think of was that a 1970 Mustang, treated moderately well and maintained regularly, is still a useful car fifty years later. In fact, if it's survived, the asking price is within spitting distance of a new Mustang. Is there any chance that a 2023 Mustang will be a useful vehicle in 2073? Will any 20…

I agree with your general point regarding the durability of older cars. But any 1970 Mustang still running and in good shape has required a lot of maintenance and work. Part of me wonders whether the move to electric vehicles from ICE will resemble the move from CRT to LCD televisions. Less robust and initially more expensive, but high consumer satisfaction and eventually economies of scale will make it cheaper.

Maintenance is cheaper for older cars, and parts are readily available. New cars are much more expensive to maintain, and the cost of parts is an order of magnitude higher.

All of the cars being produced today will be junk in 20 years. Actually, I take that back; they are junk the moment they roll off the line.

Re: Mercedes-Benz previews its operating system MB.OS

#160
post #33

Everyones talking about alot of negatives. But I have a E53 AMG 4matic+ coup. It looks amazing, like constant compliments, i've even had people compliment it and give me their number in a wendy's drive through. But the OS(MBUX 2) is actually really good, at first I was a bit negative on it. But the way they have everything integrated that isn't really possible with apple play is nice. The dash is customizable, I have…

Are you showing off here?
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