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Is there a market failure in child care?

arnoldkling.substack.com

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Re: Is there a market failure in child care?

#51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Grandparents are now paid out via violence against the children (aka taxes) once they grow up. Why would they participate in raising the kid when the unspoken quid-pro-quo is no longer present and their benefits are guaranteed? There used to be significant bilateral benefit.

I guess that's the state of the world today, where actual violence is rare enough that people start calling things that don't cause any bodily harm with the same term.

Question: if I stop paying my taxes will the sheriff come with guns and toss me out? How many people want to find out?

This happens with social security and other taxes too, just usually takes a bit longer and they wait until you owe a lot more. The violence is there, it's just under the polite veneer of pay up or get got.

Re: Is there a market failure in child care?

#52
An interesting factoid is that Nanny share, split 3 ways, costs the same, or less, than daycare. The only disadvantage of nanny shares is the unreliability, when one family drops out the other families have to work hard to fill the vacancy, which involves doing what amounts to personality interviews.

New daycares, at least in Seattle, also have huge costs associated with property. Basically the majority of existing home based daycares have been around for awhile, since land prices prohibit opening any new locations. E.g. buying a "house" for daycare would cost $4000 a month in mortgage payments at minimum, which sort of ruins the finances. Lots of exceptions and such of course to quibble over, but after spending over a year looking at daycares, very few new locations are opening.

Figure 4k a month, at 15 kids, is $266 of the expenses.

Labor is of course the main problem, but labor costs are high because living in cities is so expensive, and that is expensive largely because housing is expensive.

When touring daycares I like to talk to the child care providers one on one w/o management there, and I always ask how well they are treated. Universally they have said that the large chain locations treat workers badly, and that you also get what you pay for with the higher priced providers, workers who are paid better (but not great), are also treated better, stay around longer, and burn out less.

> GONZALEZ: You need one teacher for every four infants, at least.

Infant care is obscene. This is where long childcare leave can help, if parents both have 6 months off at 100% salary, that gets the kid through the first year, after which childcare becomes a lot more reasonable.

There is another huge drop off in complexity at 18 months, but I don't see a good way of getting families to that mark. Lots of daycares do 18m+ because the logistics are just way simpler.

Re: Is there a market failure in child care?

#53

I live in one of those cities that regularly makes the best places to live lists. I’m not able to get a spot in a before or after school program for my children, regardless of price. The one child center that serves the school has already filled their slots for the fall. Seems like this well educated, high income market is still organized around one parent not working full time or a grandparent living nearby.

I completely agree. There is an assumption of one or the other and not enough childcare supply to meet the true demand of two working parent communities.

Re: Is there a market failure in child care?

#54

> Suppose that the parents have two children who need child care. That is $540 per week. The parent salary has to be at least $540 per week to make the choice of child care economical. But that does not take into account taxes. Even worse than that, it doesn’t take into account commutes, and the opportunity cost of not spending time with your own kids. If you make just enough money at work to pay for childcare, what…

I know you're being rhetorical, but often, just trying to avoid a gap in your resume. It sucks but there can be a greater long-term cost to trying to reenter the workforce after taking years off to raise kids.

I am just curious, is this a hypothetical or do you know of many people who actually made the explicit choice to break even working, just to have continuity of resume?

It smells a little like BS to me, both because it seems to be often repeated (so sounds like a talking point) but I can't imagine any parents I know to actually decide this way

Re: Is there a market failure in child care?

#55

> Suppose that the parents have two children who need child care. That is $540 per week. The parent salary has to be at least $540 per week to make the choice of child care economical. But that does not take into account taxes. Even worse than that, it doesn’t take into account commutes, and the opportunity cost of not spending time with your own kids. If you make just enough money at work to pay for childcare, what…

Children are not in daycare for their parents' entire lives. Once children reach kindergarten, many public school systems provide after-school care for working parents that is significantly cheaper than private daycare. Some provide before-school care as well, but usually schools time their starts to community work schedules.

If you make just enough to pay for childcare now and decide to, instead, leave your job to spend time with your children, you are giving up some number of years of professional job growth. When you return to the market, you will likely not have grown your skills and will most likely enter around the same pay level as when you left. If you stay in the market, you will have spent that money on childcare, but you will now most likely have grown your salary through wage increases and job transitions.

In addition, while you may be giving up some time with your children during their early years, they also gain substantial growth with their peers and outside influences which may help them as they grow older.

My wife and I made this choice with our children, and that was what the heck we were doing. Childcare was expensive, but we knew it had a time limit, and when our children finally entered public school, we were substantially better off than if one of us had left our jobs. We feel the experience for our children was great as well, considering they still speak fondly of their pre-K experiences.

Re: Is there a market failure in child care?

#56
It’s a social failure that we put the cost of caring for very young children exclusively on the shoulders of their young parents. As a society, we collectively pay for the healthcare of old people as a shared burden spread across our whole lives. We do the same for care of children ages 6-18 via public schools.

You have kids age 1-6? Tough shit, pay up.

Re: Is there a market failure in child care?

#57

Hilarious to call it a market failure. If you deregulate childcare, something or another will appear at every price point. You may not like some of those solutions, but they'll exist.

In markets without regulations, disreputable daycare will straight up sell children. Doesn't quite qualify as "hilarious" in my book.

Re: Is there a market failure in child care?

#58
post #2

The failure to me seems in outsourcing your child to a daycare, vs parents having flexible schedules to actually take care of your kid (either 1 with PT job or staying home FT, or both with flexible jobs). I understand this isn't popular in our culture these days, but I imagine it has many positive outcomes for the child and family.

Pretty much. Parents in my neighborhood pooled together and made sure that one of them always had a day off to pick up the kids from school and home and feed them until the other parents got off work.

How many nine-month-olds were among that group?

Re: Is there a market failure in child care?

#59

A few thoughts: 1. Waitlists are a scam. In NYC, it's ~$150 non-refundable just to apply, and daycares won't tell you how long their waitlist is (and per the article, are often over subscribed). I wish there was legislation that these are refundable, or capped at ~$20 or so. 2. The cost of daycare here is around $2500/kid. So with two kids, you're looking at $60k/year, which is $100k pre-tax. And so if you have two k…

That must be a NYC thing, none of the childcare options we looked at asked us to pay to be on a waitlist.

Re: Is there a market failure in child care?

#60

A few thoughts: 1. Waitlists are a scam. In NYC, it's ~$150 non-refundable just to apply, and daycares won't tell you how long their waitlist is (and per the article, are often over subscribed). I wish there was legislation that these are refundable, or capped at ~$20 or so. 2. The cost of daycare here is around $2500/kid. So with two kids, you're looking at $60k/year, which is $100k pre-tax. And so if you have two k…

I think people do work to break even or even worse. You only need childcare for 4 or 5 years until the kid is old enough to go to public kindergarten. If you are 25 and take a break from the workforce for 5 years you are going to obliterate your career. meanwhile if you had been working at say 25 in NYC at 100k/year and kept working w/ the support of childcare then by 30 you could be making 150 or 200k/year. If you h…

Now THAT is a market failure. Create a company staffed with parents who have a gap in their resumes. Pay them slightly less than market rate. In theory, that should be very profitable. In practice there are too many confounding issues and I doubt this would be successful, although I do think the companies can do quite well by disregarding explainable gaps in one's resume.
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