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Replacing my MacBook Air M1 with a ThinkPad T480

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Re: Replacing my MacBook Air M1 with a ThinkPad T480

#311

Post by taylodl »

stinkytaco wrote: post #296
taylodl wrote: post #284

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the same feedback Apple has been getting for 11 years now. There's nothing new here. I think Apple is well-aware that there are people who prefer an upgradeable laptop and not having to participate in the Apple ecosystem. I suspect Apple has data showing even more people prefer having a more reliable laptop (upgradeability tends to decrease reliability) and the perceived benefits of the Apple ecosystem - otherwi…

I skeptical that non upgradability increases reliability. I have never heard this claim before. I have heard it decreases thickness and weight, both of which people might like, but increasing reliability? How much of that can just be attributed to improved components as manufacturing gets more sophisticated? I think this is just down to most people not caring. I like the idea of upgradability as an abstract concept,…

I used to work for an industrial automation company, building custom-designed computers (the entire system, including the motherboard) that control manufacturing lines. The units we used to design, being field upgradeable, were far less reliable than the units where the memory and CPU were soldered to the motherboard. That wasn't an option for mass storage at the time. Vibration and heat do amazing things to components that are removable. Also, components that are soldered on the mainboard, by not using a socket, generate less heat. The interconnect can also be faster. So yes, upgradeability does tend to decrease reliability. By the time I left that company they had switched to entirely non-upgradeable units because they were far more reliable.

Re: Replacing my MacBook Air M1 with a ThinkPad T480

#312

Post by ibz »

schwartzworld wrote: post #304
taylodl wrote: post #285

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But as it’s bad for the environment Is it? Thanks to the increased reliability that non-upgradeability confers I'm still using my 2012 MacBook Pro as my daily driver. I suspect there's a lot of minutia to tease out to verify whether this claim is actually true in the global case.

2012 MVP was a solid computer. I've been supplied MacBooks at work that have all been newer and less reliable.

2012 MBP was indeed my final reliable Apple product. I "upgraded" away from it unfortunately (because jobs always paid for these things) which resulted in me throwing away at least 3 newer models, which simply stopped working. I'm gladly off Apple for 2 years now!

Re: Replacing my MacBook Air M1 with a ThinkPad T480

#314

Post by hbn »

javaunsafe2019 wrote: post #279
taylodl wrote: post #277

It's been 11 years since Apple first released non-upgradeable laptops. Can we get over it already? If you want a laptop that you can upgrade then don't buy an Apple. If you don't like Apple's ecosystem then don't buy an Apple. This has been the advice for over 10 years now. There's nothing new here.

But as it’s bad for the environment it’s even more important in 2023 to keep complaining about it.

His 4th point in the conclusion at the end:

> I wanted a cheap travel laptop I could replace without blinking an eye at the price.

It's pretty easy to get ~10 years out of a good laptop from Apple. I'll be shocked if this guy is still using his Thinkpad in 10 years, and even if he does, that he didn't create more e-waste by swapping parts that he wouldn't have had to sticking with the MacBook.

Re: Replacing my MacBook Air M1 with a ThinkPad T480

#315

Post by ibz »

dagw wrote: post #294
javaunsafe2019 wrote: post #279

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But as it’s bad for the environment it’s even more important in 2023 to keep complaining about it.

Based on highly unscientific observation, people tend to keep using old Apple laptops much longer than random Not Apple laptops.

Old Apple laptops, like the 2012 mentioned, yes. Newer ones don't really last long anymore.

Re: Replacing my MacBook Air M1 with a ThinkPad T480

#316

Post by Ancapistani »

jeroenhd wrote: post #227
criddell wrote: post #171

> I've had quite enough of Microsoft's constant nagging to upgrade to Windows 11 I’m surprised he’s seeing a lot of nagging. That machine can’t even run Windows 11.

You think that stops Windows 10 from showing popups? I get those every time I boot Windows on my 7700k. At first I thought they relaxed their requirements and clicked the ads to see what it'd do but then it would just tell me my machine is incompatible. I think they've fixed their detection recently but there are still references to Windows 11 all over the place.

Better still - I upgraded my gaming desktop with a new CPU the day Microsoft messed up the upgrade detection for Windows 11. The first time I booted it with the new CPU it showed me the "Upgrade to Windows 11" screen for the first time. I though "Oh, cool, my CPU must have been the bottleneck. Sure, go for it."

Turns out, it was just coincidental timing and my desktop lacks TPM. It's still running Windows 11 and I've not run into any issues, but AFAIK I won't be able to re-install it if I ever format the drive.

Re: Replacing my MacBook Air M1 with a ThinkPad T480

#317

Post by rr888 »

Reason077 wrote: post #197
philipphutterer wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It didn't say so in the post but I suspect 8GB RAM were just not enough and an upgrade was necessary anyway? And future upgrading was mentioned. In my opinion this is a valid point actually and should be very much considered when buying any of the modern all-fixed-no-upgrades machines, I mean its not just the Apple machines.

I've used an 8GB M1 Air for the past 2 years and it's totally fine. My brother got the 16GB and there is no noticable difference in performance for any of my usual apps. Going from 8GB -> 16GB in an M1 just doesn't make much difference, except perhaps for a few specialised apps that require a ton of VRAM.

Thanks I've been debating this. 8GB just feels wrong but I hate to pay that Apple upgrade premium.

Re: Replacing my MacBook Air M1 with a ThinkPad T480

#318

Post by howinteresting »

taylodl wrote: post #277

It's been 11 years since Apple first released non-upgradeable laptops. Can we get over it already? If you want a laptop that you can upgrade then don't buy an Apple. If you don't like Apple's ecosystem then don't buy an Apple. This has been the advice for over 10 years now. There's nothing new here.

Apple is the world's most valuable corporation, they can deal with some criticism.

Re: Replacing my MacBook Air M1 with a ThinkPad T480

#319

Post by bluedino »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #310
ostenning wrote: post #20

I've owned an upgraded T480 since they were released, run archlinux on it. It was a decent computer, but despite having upgraded the battery to the largest possible configuration and using all the tricks in the book to maximize battery life in linux - it sucked. The reality is these Intel processors are just a big inefficient hot mess. I ended up upgrading to the 14" M1 Max, and there is literally no way you can make…

The battery life (and in some cases, horrifically bad TN panel screens) are what kills these older ThinkPads, Latitudes, etc for daily drivers. If I’m spending so much time at my desk that being tethered doesn’t matter I’d be better off building a desktop with modern hardware, which confers the biggest benefits of ThinkPads while also being vastly more powerful and expandable. If space is an issue, ITX builds solve t…

> horrifically bad TN panel screens

The only 'great' ThinkPad screen is the 14" WQHD (2560x1440)

The others are just...bad. So dim, dull colors, and the low-end screens are sad, terribly washed out TN panels

Re: Replacing my MacBook Air M1 with a ThinkPad T480

#320

Post by notpublic »

taylodl wrote: post #284
magic_hamster wrote: post #281

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Obviously anyone will get the computer they want, well at least when you can. Sometimes you get stuck with a choice someone else made, like a company device. However, it is still useful to voice and especially to listen to criticism. Apple should be thankful that a lot of people are voicing their opinions. Getting this kind of feedback is priceless if they want to appeal to more people and grow their user base.

It's the same feedback Apple has been getting for 11 years now. There's nothing new here. I think Apple is well-aware that there are people who prefer an upgradeable laptop and not having to participate in the Apple ecosystem. I suspect Apple has data showing even more people prefer having a more reliable laptop (upgradeability tends to decrease reliability) and the perceived benefits of the Apple ecosystem - otherwi…

"IMPORTANT: BY USING YOUR MAC PRODUCT, YOU ARE AGREEING TO BE BOUND BY THE TERMS OF THE APPLE 1 YEAR LIMITED WARRANTY (“WARRANTY”) AS SET OUT BELOW...."

If the product is that reliable, why not offer a 3-5 year warranty?

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