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A global addiction to plastic is turning into an environmental disaster

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Re: A global addiction to plastic is turning into an environmental disaster

#41

Post by abdullahkhalids »

Scoundreller wrote: post #30
abdullahkhalids wrote: post #3

I have significantly reduced the use of plastic in the kitchen over the past few years. * Only metal or glass containers (sometimes with plastic lids) * But fresh vegetables/fruits (95% of these are not covered in plastic) and grains/spices from bulk barn (take your own glass containers and fill them up). * Meat and dairy comes in plastic wrap or bottles. But I am hoping to find a butcher who will let me take away th…

> * Have reusable bags for groceries that last many years. I find that now I need to buy bags (in a box!!!) for trash. Bags that are much thicker than I need most of the time. > Buy fresh vegetables/fruits (95% of these are not covered in plastic) In France, supermarket customers have to self-weigh their vegetables/fruit purchases and only recently did stop making you put things like your weighed bananas in bags. Cas…

I have never put produce in the plastic bags available. I just put them directly in my shopping basket. Then go to self checkout and put them in my reusable bag.

Re: A global addiction to plastic is turning into an environmental disaster

#42

Post by abdullahkhalids »

TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #4
abdullahkhalids wrote: post #3

I have significantly reduced the use of plastic in the kitchen over the past few years. * Only metal or glass containers (sometimes with plastic lids) * But fresh vegetables/fruits (95% of these are not covered in plastic) and grains/spices from bulk barn (take your own glass containers and fill them up). * Meat and dairy comes in plastic wrap or bottles. But I am hoping to find a butcher who will let me take away th…

> Have reusable bags for groceries that last many years There is another way. After you’ve paid for the items, put them back into the shopping cart. This is very easy at self checkout. Take the cart to your car and unload the items into one or more plastic bins (typically used to store stuff long-term and come with lids). Carry the bins into the kitchen when you arrive home and unload. I can fit all groceries into on…

Don't have a car or a license. I walk/bike/transit to the markets.

I am looking for a cart [1], that I can push to the store and back with my groceries. Ideally, it will have large tires so it can actually be used in the winter.

[1] which doesn't look like a stolen shopping cart

Re: A global addiction to plastic is turning into an environmental disaster

#43

Post by shortcake27 »

arcticbull wrote: post #36
RandomWorker wrote: post #35

Markets are efficient and fossil fuel companies are ruthless in making money. So obviously they will price their new plastics always cheaper than recycled. Cost of recycled and new plastic can easily be inverted by just taxing new plastic until it’s twice as expensive as recycled. Recycled can be subsidized with new plastic taxes. Problem solved!

Globally only 9% [1] of plastic waste is recycled, and there's a lot of reasons why. It can be dirty, contaminated, low-grade, or simply require more inputs than producing new plastic. The idea that plastic can be meaningfully recycled was an oil industry propaganda campaign to make people feel better about consuming it. The only way to really make a dent here is to reduce consumption. We do agree though that the ext…

I cannot agree enough with this statement. While some products such as glass and aluminium can be recycled quite effectively, I can’t help but cringe when literally every recycling bin I peek into is filled with 90% contaminated or flat out non-recyclables, because people just put everything in the wrong bin to avoid guilt. I wonder if recycling is even a net positive at this point? Ie, would we be better just throwing everything in the trash if it meant people actually considered their consumption?

Another crazy invention is “compostable” packaging. This has really taken off in the past few years. Yet no one seems to understand that it needs to be composted commercially, yet virtually none of it is. It can’t be recycled, and if you put it in the bin, it won’t compost. Conveniently this is never mentioned. These products are basically a trick designed to keep consumption high by allowing individuals to absolve themselves of guilt.

Reducing consumption is the only solution.

Re: A global addiction to plastic is turning into an environmental disaster

#44

Post by abdullahkhalids »

thowfaraway wrote: post #9
abdullahkhalids wrote: post #3

I have significantly reduced the use of plastic in the kitchen over the past few years. * Only metal or glass containers (sometimes with plastic lids) * But fresh vegetables/fruits (95% of these are not covered in plastic) and grains/spices from bulk barn (take your own glass containers and fill them up). * Meat and dairy comes in plastic wrap or bottles. But I am hoping to find a butcher who will let me take away th…

"Meat and dairy comes in plastic wrap or bottles." I kind feel like if your butcher doesn't use butcher paper, you aren't really going to a butcher but a meat department at a grocery store.

I go to an independent locally-run "meat shop" as they call it. Thy do use butcher paper, but then put the whole thing in a plastic bag to prevent leakage.

I haven't actually asked them if I can bring my own container. Maybe they will be open to it.

Re: A global addiction to plastic is turning into an environmental disaster

#45

Post by arcticbull »

shortcake27 wrote: post #43
arcticbull wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Globally only 9% [1] of plastic waste is recycled, and there's a lot of reasons why. It can be dirty, contaminated, low-grade, or simply require more inputs than producing new plastic. The idea that plastic can be meaningfully recycled was an oil industry propaganda campaign to make people feel better about consuming it. The only way to really make a dent here is to reduce consumption. We do agree though that the ext…

I cannot agree enough with this statement. While some products such as glass and aluminium can be recycled quite effectively, I can’t help but cringe when literally every recycling bin I peek into is filled with 90% contaminated or flat out non-recyclables, because people just put everything in the wrong bin to avoid guilt. I wonder if recycling is even a net positive at this point? Ie, would we be better just throwi…

It's even worse when you put contaminated plastics in the recycling bins because if a container load exceeds a certain threshold level of contamination the whole load has to be landfilled.

Re: A global addiction to plastic is turning into an environmental disaster

#46

Post by an_aparallel »

hammock wrote: post #28

Most plastic is not consumer but business use. As much as you think your veggies wrapped in plastic is bad, everything in the supply chain leading to your veggies was wrapped in plastic: the pallet they came on, every part that went into making the truck that shipped it (multiple times, as the truck in various states of manufacture made its way around several different geographically dispersed factories), the soil an…

this is one of the biggest frustrations i have about "making the right choices" and any other instances where organisations/governments try to make it out like individual choice makes a dent in the actual problem space.

i could throw a piece of plastic rubbish every day on the street for the rest of my life - and it would still not put anywhere near a dent in the problem. All the while - technology companies continue to create un-repairable products, released at shorter time scales, whilst convincing people what they already have needs upgrading.

Fix the system first... :/

Re: A global addiction to plastic is turning into an environmental disaster

#48

Post by Scoundreller »

ChuckNorris89 wrote: post #37
Scoundreller wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Also comes down to why the water is non-drinkable. Could it be filtered on-premises?

And/or boiled beforehand?

Depends on what the contamination is. If it's lead, you're just concentrating the lead and making things worse.

Re: A global addiction to plastic is turning into an environmental disaster

#49

Post by seadan83 »

RandomWorker wrote: post #35

Markets are efficient and fossil fuel companies are ruthless in making money. So obviously they will price their new plastics always cheaper than recycled. Cost of recycled and new plastic can easily be inverted by just taxing new plastic until it’s twice as expensive as recycled. Recycled can be subsidized with new plastic taxes. Problem solved!

Fossil fuel companies certainly are ruthless. Though, there's no need for them to play pricing games with recycled plastic. Tax-wise, there is not nearly enough recycled plastic. It turns out most plastic cannot be recycled at all. A number of stories broke not too long ago that the myth of plastic recycling was pushed by oil industries to make everyone feel good about using plastic because they were then "recycling" it.

Some references:

"How Big Oil Misled The Public Into Believing Plastic Would Be Recycled" - https://www.npr.org/2020/09/11/897692090/how-big-oil-misled-...

"California is investigating Big Oil for allegedly misleading the public on recycling" - https://www.npr.org/2022/04/28/1095305949/california-is-inve...

"Big Oil Sold the World on a Plastics Recycling Myth. It May Be Too Late to Undo the Damage" - https://time.com/6173859/plastic-recycling-big-oil-damage/

Re: A global addiction to plastic is turning into an environmental disaster

#50

Post by agapon »

abdullahkhalids wrote: post #42
TedDoesntTalk wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Have reusable bags for groceries that last many years There is another way. After you’ve paid for the items, put them back into the shopping cart. This is very easy at self checkout. Take the cart to your car and unload the items into one or more plastic bins (typically used to store stuff long-term and come with lids). Carry the bins into the kitchen when you arrive home and unload. I can fit all groceries into on…

Don't have a car or a license. I walk/bike/transit to the markets. I am looking for a cart [1], that I can push to the store and back with my groceries. Ideally, it will have large tires so it can actually be used in the winter. [1] which doesn't look like a stolen shopping cart

"shopping bag on wheels"
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