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Ask HN: Where are laid off employees gathering?

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Re: Ask HN: Where are laid off employees gathering?

#101

Post by marcusverus »

throwawaaarrgh wrote: post #14

It just occurred to me that so many people were laid off, we could start the world's largest software co-op (and arguably one of the largest tech orgs, period). We could build software products that every industry needs, that every worker owns a part of and can vote on org-wide decisions. Literally everyone you need was laid off... Tech people, business people, marketing, sales, etc. We just need a forum and some vol…

It's hard to imagine such an organization working out over the long term. The incentives are all wonky! The more you contribute, the more you sacrifice by joining a coop. The less you contribute, the more you gain. I for one can't think of a less attractive idea than taking a product idea that I love and turning ownership and creative control over to a group of strangers.

And that's probably why these things are so rare. After all, it would take a helluva lot of drive and energy to bring such a thing to life--probably much more than it would take to start a company in the usual way. If you were capable of building such an organization, why not retain creative control of your ideas and make millions at the same time?

Making millions doesn't have to be a selfish act, by the way. If you want to help people, money affords you the opportunity to do so in any way you please. Horray, effective altruism!

Meanwhile, if you start a software co-op... who exactly are you helping? Software developers, who get a chunk of profits instead of a measly 150K? Software consumers, who're likely business owners? Folks who have money to pay for software?

Re: Ask HN: Where are laid off employees gathering?

#102

Post by lazyasciiart »

DiggyJohnson wrote: post #49
galleywest200 wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Being laid off does not equate to doing poorly. Some people just get cut because some people who wear suits to work seem to not care.

I think you're interpreting "doing poorly" wrong. I read GP as saying that people who are laid off are currently going through a stressful time in their life: "doing poorly".

Support groups are common for all kinds of things, so there seems to be some kind of value in it.

Re: Ask HN: Where are laid off employees gathering?

#103

Post by aaomidi »

twblalock wrote: post #97
whatshisface wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A co-op can mean a lot of things, but in particular it means an employee-owned business. For all of the reasons not to get behind the idea of a company without a billionaire at the top, the Hobbesian faith in the monarch could be the worst one. The functional difference between a co-op and a normal business could be as small as having a board that is informed (because the shareholders are employees and naturally very…

Ok, show me a single example of this model working for a software business that makes a profit. Just one. I honestly can't find any.

Companies in new areas of technology generally started with a concentration of power and after a while that concentration of power goes away. Every new tech has effectively had this.

Anyway our economic model is toxic to cooperative businesses. So yeah it’s gonna be hard to find examples of successful coops.

Re: Ask HN: Where are laid off employees gathering?

#104

Post by whatshisface »

robswc wrote: post #100
whatshisface wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

With the way investors handle things these days the ceiling for founders is a lot lower than you think.

How would you achieve similar comp in the system OP describes?

I didn't think the OP described a comp structure. The org-wide decisions being put to a vote already happens in a lot of public companies, and it would be the employees voting if they were the shareholders. It's a really straightforward idea.

Re: Ask HN: Where are laid off employees gathering?

#105

Post by Aunche »

asdff wrote: post #88
chitowneats wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some of the best engineers I've ever worked don't even have a bachelor's degree. These autodidacts will suffer greatly if the wrong kind of "software guild" gains control over licensing tech employees.

SAG doesn't require a degree in screen acting. It's a little convoluted but they basically operate mainly on proof of work. That sort of system would probably give self taught engineers who spent their years from 18-22 doing actual work a huge leg up compared to those who were in school during that time doing no work on any projects for any company.

>It's a little convoluted but they basically operate mainly on proof of work.

It's mainly leveraging cartel power rather than proof of work. Even if you have a lot of experience acting in non-union productions, you're still ineligible from joining SAG. To be clear, I don't think this is a bad thing for SAG because the number of aspiring actors far exceeds demand, so SAG increase wages without causing the most of negative effects with cartels, but I don't think this is the same for tech.

Re: Ask HN: Where are laid off employees gathering?

#106

Post by [deleted] »

aaomidi wrote: post #103
twblalock wrote: post #97

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ok, show me a single example of this model working for a software business that makes a profit. Just one. I honestly can't find any.

Companies in new areas of technology generally started with a concentration of power and after a while that concentration of power goes away. Every new tech has effectively had this. Anyway our economic model is toxic to cooperative businesses. So yeah it’s gonna be hard to find examples of successful coops.

[deleted]

Re: Ask HN: Where are laid off employees gathering?

#107

Post by twalla »

kulahan wrote: post #15
dangwhy wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

blind has to be the most toxic community in tech. I don't know if i can handle the mental damage for referrals and insider info on prospective employers.

Everyone on Blind is a Principal Engineer making $750k TC while only working 8 hours a month

You forgot the weekly posts about which brand of toilet bowl cleaner has the most prestige.

Re: Ask HN: Where are laid off employees gathering?

#109

Post by superb-owl »

twblalock wrote: post #97
whatshisface wrote: post #89

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A co-op can mean a lot of things, but in particular it means an employee-owned business. For all of the reasons not to get behind the idea of a company without a billionaire at the top, the Hobbesian faith in the monarch could be the worst one. The functional difference between a co-op and a normal business could be as small as having a board that is informed (because the shareholders are employees and naturally very…

Ok, show me a single example of this model working for a software business that makes a profit. Just one. I honestly can't find any.

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