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IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

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Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#221

Post by justeleblanc »

mardifoufs wrote: post #214
justeleblanc wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> No. It has had numerous outages in the last 4 years. That's just plain false. There was one major outage in 2019. Since then, nothing of note.

I think it has, when compared to GPS or even GLONASS. https://insidegnss.com/galileo-logs-a-5-hour-timing-related-... https://berthub.eu/articles/posts/galileo-accident/

The second link is the major outage I'm talking about, yes.

The first one is indeed significant, but to call it an outage is a stretch. You're linking to some blogspam that is basically [copying the official statement](https://www.gsc-europa.eu/news/galileo-nominal-service-resto...). To link that without linking to the [follow-up explanation](https://www.gsc-europa.eu/news/further-information-on-the-ev...) is, well... Not exactly an okay move. In that follow-up, you'll read that only ill-configured receivers (that ignored satellite health) were affected.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#222

Post by generalizations »

lokar wrote: post #209
alright_scowl wrote: post #160

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The odd part is that these bad takes seem to typically come from people that don't even live the EU, and don't understand how it works. They just don't like that it exists.

[flagged]

> Most of them will grow out of it eventually.

On the other hand, condescension is harder to grow out of.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#223

Post by sgc »

pxmpxm wrote: post #191
j_san wrote: post #80

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm european and dont like thousands of satelites swirrling around in the sky as well but I'd rather have government-founded satelites for the public benefit than from some way-too-rich sociopath's private company. Of course - this project would probably not exist without Starlink, so credit where credit is due. Personally I find it quite sad that we're destroying the night sky in the sense that before these projects…

> some way-too-rich sociopath's private company. I am certainly you've developed this view in November of 2022. Meanwhile any European stuck with DSL - which would be most of my family - would be ecstatic to get sensible bandwidth today.

And yet, it does not matter when anybody became aware, but when it became a real problem.

Further, one can make use of a service or product today, and still be happy that there are better alternatives in the pipeline. I am certain that is how many Tesla owners view their vehicles, for example.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#224

Post by justeleblanc »

CamperBob2 wrote: post #219
justeleblanc wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Any examples you'd care to elaborate about?

Galileo might be a good example to discuss in this context.

Are you talking about the satellite navigation system that's been usable and widely used for about a decade? The one that gives location data ten times more precise than GPS (1m vs 10m)? That's a "failed copy costing billions to Europeans"? Really?

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#225

Post by abudabi123 »

Deukhoofd wrote: post #62
kensai wrote: post #28

There is always bashing if there is something about the EU and its national projects, not always deserved. However sometimes I wished HN showed more of local projects. For example: has there been a post about the European AI? https://www.aleph-alpha.com/

It's honestly got to the point where I barely open comments related to EU projects any more. While most of the time there's somewhat nuanced discussions in comments, once the EU gets mentioned for some reason most of the comments basically boil down to "EU bad, US better", and "Big government bad", completely ignoring the actual contents of what the post it about.

    the comments basically boil down to "EU bad, US better"
Nothing stops the EU from landing a probe on the surface of Mars, successfully.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#226

Post by haneefmubarak »

sofixa wrote: post #113
inglor_cz wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Insulting to companies such as Doctolib (revolutionised health appointments, a single platform to book one, send your documents if needed, have ones online, etc.), Back Market, fintechs such as Qonto and Swile, Ornikar, etc. etc." Do you realize that even here on HN, the percentage of people who know at least one of those names is likely to be in low single digits? Compared to Google or Meta or Apple or Microsoft, t…

> Do you realize that even here on HN, the percentage of people who know at least one of those names is likely to be in low single digits? And that's fine because those companies are serving the French market first? I don't expect French people to know about Zelle or Konbini payments.

Zelle and Konbini are both also tiny dwarfs, that aren't really good examples of at-scale success, esp with anything that has any adjacency to tech.

I say this as an avid Zelle user.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#227

Post by ohgodplsno »

amm wrote: post #172
viraptor wrote: post #156

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> too expensive What's your source for good cost of launching satellite communication networks? Would you like to show us the reasoning here? > it should have invested proactively in next gen satellite direct to device tech If the current one works - why would they? For defence usage, reliable is better than next gen usually. (Something something next gen F35 still not usable) > I wonder where cost competitive launch…

> What's your source for good cost of launching satellite communication networks? - falcon 9 - $2700/kg - falcon heavy - $1400/kg - ariane 5 - $9000/kg > If the current one works - why would they? This is just low quality flame bait. If any of the before-mentioned (US) companies succeed commercially long-term, they will transform world-wide internet access especially in less developed countries. For clarification: as…

Falcon 9 Success Rate - 173 / 184 (94%) - Most of it LEO Falcon 9 Max Payload - 22 tons LEO, 8 tons GTO when all the conditions perfectly align and then it still kinda sucks.

Falcon Heavy Success Rate - 5 / 5 (100%) - No track record Falcon Heavy Max Payload - 83 tons LEO, 26 tons GTO

Ariane 5 Success Rate - 110/115 (95.7%) - 7 to 10 tons GTO, Most of it GTO

Falcon Heavy's cost is still theoretical, when it has barely launched anything in orbit. Ariane 5 works, extremely well. Self flagellation about EU space tech serves no purpose.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#228

Post by abudabi123 »

ginko wrote: post #111
emilburzo wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Why does European airbus thrive, while us aircraft industry declined? The documentary "Downfall: The Case Against Boeing"[1] goes into this topic, and I believe the wiki page[2] summary captures it nicely: > "There were many decades when Boeing did extraordinary things by focusing on excellence and safety and ingenuity. Those three virtues were seen as the key to profit. It could work, and beautifully. And then the…

I've heard one theory that the merger with McDonnell Douglas swept the bean-counters from there into executive positions ruining the engineering focus at Boeing.

The Microsoft spreadsheet happy-hippos are relying on India to buy enormous sums of Boeing passenger planes is one headline the media is running with, and another line of propaganda is to not bet against India. They say.

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#229

Post by permo-w »

mardifoufs wrote: post #211
kensai wrote: post #28

There is always bashing if there is something about the EU and its national projects, not always deserved. However sometimes I wished HN showed more of local projects. For example: has there been a post about the European AI? https://www.aleph-alpha.com/

This is a bit crazy to me since it seems like there is a constant, almost never ending praise for everything related to Europe here. But I totally get that it's probably a difference in what topic we browse and what comments we read, so your experience is just as valid. I guess it's just surprising to me!

that’s strange. every EU-related thread I’ve ever seen has had highly ranked comments poo-pooing whatever it is they’re planning to do.

what’s your position on the EU? perhaps I notice the negative comments more because I’m very pro-EU, and vv for you?

Re: IRIS²: The EU’s Response to Musk’s Starlink

#230

Post by jq-r »

peterfirefly wrote: post #64
inglor_cz wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That is somewhat of an indictment of the "single market" idea, or, more precisely, of its implementation. We still have shocking differences not just in tech, but in food quality across the EU. Whatever sells in Czechia, Croatia or Bulgaria tends to be a) more expensive than in Germany and b) less good. I can't imagine the same happening in the US; Mississippians wouldn't tolerate being fed with worse cheese than New…

> Whatever sells in Czechia, Croatia or Bulgaria tends to be a) more expensive than in Germany and b) less good. I'm shocked that that is still the case. I remember recurrent news stories years ago on German TV about that exact thing, except with Poland. Poles who lived close to the border shopped food in Germany for that very reason. I don't understand why food would be more expensive in countries with lower wages.…

It's still a thing. A lot of people in Croatia still buy specific food products in supermarkets like Lidl and Muller because they carry the same products as in Germany or Austria. So of much better quality of course.

The price at the time is generaly considerably higher than in neighbouring countries because VAT is just a part of the general taxation scheme. Whatever taxes companies get saddled with just get transferred to the general population via prices on the stuff they sell. And taxation in Croatia is crazy high unfortunately for everyone.

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