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Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

economist.com

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Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#61

Post by mft_ »

Eh, this is a very city-centric view.

As discussed many times past, including on HN, if you live in or near a major city, and in a country or area which prioritises goood public transport, you can get by admirably --even better-- without a car.

As soon as you move even a little away from the metropolis, and/or to somewhere that doesn't prioritise good public transport, access (at least) to a car becomes close to a necessity for many activities. This rule holds true in my direct experience in the UK, US, Switzerland, and Germany.

For example, in the US compare living in Denver to a small town a couple of hours' drive out in the sticks. Or in the UK, living in one of the major cities to virtually anywhere in the countryside.

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#62

Post by runako »

david-gpu wrote: post #51
moffkalast wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with that is the part where you need to get to and from the train station to your actual destination, which could be on the very other side of town. It can be solved with shuttles or taxis, but that adds even more complexity and annoyance than just driving directly, especially with luggage.

Bike sharing services are great in those situations. You don't even need to carry your bike in the train. There is also public transit like trams and buses.

Gentle reminder that a significant portion of society is not able to carry out trips on bikes due to infirmity, disability, or needing to convey someone who cannot bike (e.g. small children).

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#63

Post by narrowtux »

mft_ wrote: post #61

Eh, this is a very city-centric view. As discussed many times past, including on HN, if you live in or near a major city, and in a country or area which prioritises goood public transport, you can get by admirably --even better-- without a car. As soon as you move even a little away from the metropolis, and/or to somewhere that doesn't prioritise good public transport, access (at least) to a car becomes close to a ne…

Nobody is talking about taking away cars from people who live outside of cities. Yet this argument always comes up when problems with cars in densely populated areas are discussed.

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#64

Post by kubb »

mft_ wrote: post #61

Eh, this is a very city-centric view. As discussed many times past, including on HN, if you live in or near a major city, and in a country or area which prioritises goood public transport, you can get by admirably --even better-- without a car. As soon as you move even a little away from the metropolis, and/or to somewhere that doesn't prioritise good public transport, access (at least) to a car becomes close to a ne…

True, the car is necessary in some more places. You wouldn't be able to bring groceries, furniture, building materials, tools etc. without it.

But whenever I can avoid driving, I prefer to do that.

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#67

Post by david-gpu »

kensai wrote: post #27

I really wished this demonisation of the car stopped. Modern cars are way more climate friendly than merely 10-20 years ago and many climate-conscious persons do pool to commute. But we need to understand. There are cases where the car is a must. Unavoidable. Imagine having toddlers, having to do heavy groceries, and living in a place with difficult landscape or challenging weather. Imagine having a neurological dise…

> Imagine having toddlers, having to do heavy groceries, and living in a place with difficult landscape or challenging weather. Imagine having a neurological disease or some other disability.

I tick all of those boxes and never had a car.

I live in the city, walking and using public transit. Toddlers love to walk and to be carried in the stroller.

Cars from the suburbs are a constant inconvenience for us living in inner cities: they are a danger to pedestrians and cyclists alike, they make our streets noisy and our air polluted.

If people liked the suburbs so much, they would stay there. But no, they want the convenience and services of the city while shoving the externalities of their lifestyle onto other people.

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#68

Post by yourusername »

wffurr wrote: post #10

There's 138 trains per day between Amsterdam and The Hague. It's faster to take the train than to drive on that trip. Driving in either city in an exercise in frustration. Why would anyone in a rich country with a high functioning rail system like The Netherlands want to drive? I don't know how many rich countries that describes, but I lived happily for years in Boston in the USA without a car. I have one now but onl…

>There's 138 trains per day between Amsterdam and The Hague. It's faster to take the train than to drive on that trip

If you're going from the Hague central station to Amsterdam central station, sure. Now plan a more typical commute from say the Hague Wateringen to the over Amstel industrial estate (It takes two times as as driving) Play around with real life scenarios. Say you're going from Amsterdam Osdorp to your work in Utrecht Lageweide. It takes twice with transit as if you were to drive even with traffic. Most Dutch people drive, especially those that can afford to.

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#69

Post by nostromo123 »

runako wrote: post #62
david-gpu wrote: post #51

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Bike sharing services are great in those situations. You don't even need to carry your bike in the train. There is also public transit like trams and buses.

Gentle reminder that a significant portion of society is not able to carry out trips on bikes due to infirmity, disability, or needing to convey someone who cannot bike (e.g. small children).

I agree, but in a short time someone will reply here to tell you how they brought their kids to kindergarten in subzero temperatures with a bike, or how they bike half an hour in rain to buy groceries...

For my family it's not even about the physical aspect, but about time. I don't want to waste my free time going to and from places in 2x/3x the time it takes by car.

Re: Throughout the rich world, the young are falling out of love with cars

#70

Post by albertopv »

Italy is made of thousands of small towns, industrial areas far from cities, all poorly connected by public transit. I really would like not to use car, but them using public transport it would take me almost an hour from home to work, 10kms, it's 15 minutes by cars. Also there are kids, if sick school will call parents to bring them home. I drive less than my parents did, if only because of higher gas prices, higher traffic and danger.
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