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Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

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Re: Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

#31

Post by agotterer »

candiddevmike wrote: post #10
rationalist wrote: post #3

And that's why I pay cash and use Jenny's Number with the local area code for the store discount program. I know Target also tracks your cellphone through the store too, I haven't bothered putting in airplane mode when I shop, so hopefully they aren't correlating that with the purchases.

I googled "Jenny's Number" thinking it was a SaaS platform

I’ll save the next person some googling - it is a hit song from 1981 by Tommy Tutone.

https://youtu.be/tHL2XeuA6Yg

Here’s a few examples of what happened to people who had that number:

In 1982, WLS radio obtained the number from a Chicago woman, receiving 22,000 calls in four days.

In 1982, Southwest Junior High School received up to two hundred calls daily asking for Jenny in area code 704.

More examples on Wikipedia - https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/867-5309/Jenny

Re: Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

#32

Post by tppiotrowski »

> Location: Your precise physical location in the store (with your consent), including when you enter and leave a store (Kroger app, GPS, and Bluetooth beacons inside stores)

Can someone comment on how a store can identify my Bluetooth address if I never pair with anything in the store? Do apps have access to the Bluetooth MAC? If the app is not running, can the store still identify you using Bluetooth? Is there some advertising database that contains MAC addresses tied to identities?

If you're on the store Wifi and open the app, I'm guessing the store can record the MAC address and look for it even if you're not connected but scanning.

Re: Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

#33

Post by _trampeltier »

tarotuser wrote: post #15
cfeduke wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This is fine, but it's not really about tracking you , it's about tracking the habits of shoppers in aggregate, of which you are a participant. (Yes, having your real address to mail flyers is a bonus but not the end goal.) The only viable solution that comes to mind is to shop at places that don't perform this sort of tracking/loyalty card/etc. and continue to pay in cash. The only stores around me that fit this bil…

> his is fine, but it's not really about tracking you, it's about tracking the habits of shoppers in aggregate, of which you are a participant. (Yes, having your real address to mail flyers is a bonus but not the end goal.) Like hell it is. This is an article about Target back in 2012, that identified a pregnant underage girl purely from her purchasing record. 11 years ago. https://www.forbes.com/sites/kashmirhill/20…

"With facial recognition being a nearly solved problem, .."

Meanwhile in Switzerland

https://www.iamexpat.ch/expat-info/swiss-expat-news/facial-r...

It’s never a nice feeling to think you are being watched, even if it is in a public place like the centre of a city or train station. Now, Swiss Federal Railways (SBB), the main public transport provider in Switzerland, has announced that it will be installing facial recognition cameras in 57 stations across the alpine nation - however, according to the company, the system only wants to know your spending habits and how often you visit each station. SBB to instal cameras to gather more data on passengers

According to 20 Minuten, SBB wants to use the cameras to “obtain high-quality data that can be used to analyse the movement of people at train stations." Unlike the 700 cameras already operating in SBB stations, the new technology will allow the international company to track all passengers individually and in more detail.

SBB said that the cameras will capture and analyse the following data sets:

    Passengers' age, size, amount of luggage and whether they have any special items (e.g. prams, wheelchairs, bicycles)
    Their route through the station
    How long each passenger remains in the station
    Customer behaviour in station shops (purchasing habits, anti-social behaviour, etc)
    Which shops are visited by passengers the most
    How much passengers spend in station shops

Re: Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

#34

Post by tarotuser »

hunter2_ wrote: post #16
account-5 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You should be alright if Bluetooth and WiFi are off. Unless you think they're spoofing a cell tower.

Does one need to spoof a tower (actively transmit/handshake) or can one simply listen? Is it virtually impossible to do some kind of phased array that tracks the location of mobile transmitters since they're encrypted? Maybe the transmissions aren't frequent/continuous enough unless the user is actively using data or on a call... I'm sure many people here know way more than I.

> Is it virtually impossible to do some kind of phased array that tracks the location of mobile transmitters since they're encrypted?

A phased array can still provide positioning reports even if it can't decipher the data. And, well, doing so would be illegal.

Frankly, I'd use facial recognition combined with a phased array to realtime plot people in a facility. And if they use their credit card, I'd then connect the CC, their face, the pattern they walked, and to the free wifi the store provides to get access to phone-OS data.

Now you can realtime track all your customers who show up. And that data gets sold to whoever buys. Hmm, buying unhealthy food from your receipt? Your insurance company bought the list and will now raise rates on you.

Re: Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

#35

Post by blamazon »

One thing I didn't see in the comments yet: at many stores in my region you can pick up a discount card and not register it, and it will still apply discounts when scanned.

Of course it won't work everywhere and it's a half measure but it's one avenue worth trying if you care about privacy to some degree but still want the discount.

Re: Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

#36

Post by Infernal »

kornhole wrote: post #29

Sometimes it feels ridiculous how much OPSEC I need to employ to buy anything at the grocery store. I walk or bike to the store to not reveal a license plate. All radios and sensors on my handset are turned off. I wear a mask to thwart facial recognition cameras. I pay cash.

Recently I’ve noticed multiple grocery store chains posting notices about how they no longer accept cash. A couple as of the new year.

Re: Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

#37

Post by reaperducer »

lelandfe wrote: post #2

I’ve just always assumed that big stores were collecting and selling every iota of data they could. I recall reading about retailers using license plate scanning in their parking lots in the early aughts.

I recall reading about retailers using license plate scanning in their parking lots in the early aughts.

They also pick up the unique IDs from the wireless air pressure monitor chips in your tires.

Even if you don't have an internet-connected car, they're still tracking you from parking lot to parking lot. That information can then be combined with time/date information and your credit/debit card purchase to identify who you are, where you shop, and what you buy.

Re: Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

#38

Post by toss1 »

AlexandrB wrote: post #19
dauut wrote: post #9

A genuine question: why does this matter for customers? Is there any foreseeable bad outcome for customers?

Maybe - insurance companies could start using your shopping habits to inform your risk group and therefore premiums. I could see other nefarious uses like tracking when female customers get pregnant for purposes of enforcing abortion bans or targeting of individuals by anti-abortion groups. I think it's a mistake to underestimate the imagination of insurance adjusters and bureaucrats when it comes to how personal dat…

Yup, this is definitely on the table since I just read the headline this morning that VA Gov Youngkin announced his opposition to a bill that would prevent law enforcement from seeking and collecting menstrual cycle data [0].

IOW, the governor of a major state (and the party that likes to tout "small government") is fully onboard with tracking your most intimate health data in order to prosecute people for medical decisions they don't like.

In comparison, use of shopping data to prosecute people will be completely ordinary.

I'd like to see someone get convicted and sue the stores for tracking them without consent.

Everyone thinks surveillance capitalism is only harmful to privacy.

They are wrong — it is literally the enabling technology for a totalitarian state. But sure, by all means, improve your next quarterly profits and nevermind the proto-fascists in the wings drooling over your tools...

[0]https://www.washingtonpost.com/dc-md-va/2023/02/14/youngkin-...

Re: Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

#39

Post by LanternLight83 »

MonkeyMalarky wrote: post #25
lelandfe wrote: post #2

I’ve just always assumed that big stores were collecting and selling every iota of data they could. I recall reading about retailers using license plate scanning in their parking lots in the early aughts.

Anywhere that collects your phone number in exchange for coupons at the checkout (cough cough Old Navy) or your email to send you a digital receipt (looking at you Home Depot) is probably sharing or selling your data.

OTOH, ubiquitus digital receipts would revolutionize automated plain text accounting for individuals.

Re: Forget Milk and Eggs: Supermarkets Are Having a Fire Sale on Data About You

#40

Post by ipaddr »

kornhole wrote: post #29

Sometimes it feels ridiculous how much OPSEC I need to employ to buy anything at the grocery store. I walk or bike to the store to not reveal a license plate. All radios and sensors on my handset are turned off. I wear a mask to thwart facial recognition cameras. I pay cash.

Biggest thing is leave the phone at home
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