Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Judge orders SBF to stop using VPNs [pdf]

ia801508.us.archive.org

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

1–10 of 20 posts

Re: Judge orders SBF to stop using VPNs [pdf]

#3

Post by macinjosh »

LatteLazy wrote: post #2

On the one hand it's nice judges are patient and lean towards liberty. On the other hand people who keep blatantly, knowingly breaking bail conditions should go to jail.

I don't like the guy but if the judge had to amend the bail conditions to exclude VPNs did he really break the bail conditions in the first place by using a VPN? It was a gray area that has been clarified by the judge. That's all really.

Re: Judge orders SBF to stop using VPNs [pdf]

#4

Post by kurisufag »

I am skeptical that the Judge (or whoever else was involved here) understands what precisely they're talking about.

By my reading, HTTPS would also violate the order, and there isn't anything you can do with an explicit VPN protocol that you can't do with a day or two of infra setup using another technology.

I am reminded of when weev set up services for himself so prison phone calls to a particular number would be automatically uploaded to soundcloud[0] and posted on twitter though prison e-mail[1]. IIRC tweets containing his name were also spooled, printed out, and mailed to him every week.

[0] https://soundcloud.com/weevlos/weev-live-from-prison-2013-04 [1] https://www.fastcompany.com/3007961/convicted-hacker-troll-w...

Re: Judge orders SBF to stop using VPNs [pdf]

#5

Post by fsckboy »

kurisufag wrote: post #4

I am skeptical that the Judge (or whoever else was involved here) understands what precisely they're talking about. By my reading, HTTPS would also violate the order, and there isn't anything you can do with an explicit VPN protocol that you can't do with a day or two of infra setup using another technology. I am reminded of when weev set up services for himself so prison phone calls to a particular number would be a…

when a judge orders you to not hide your online activity, it literally means that and doesn't matter how easy or inadvertant it is. "but judge, if I..." okay, don't do that either. "but judge, i can't..." ok, don't do that either.

>I am skeptical that the Judge understands what precisely they're talking about.

the judge knows s/he's not an expert in every domain but the law and plain English. You are required to understand plain English, or have your counsel explain it to you. If you don't have counsel, judges are actually very patient in explaining, but not in forgiving repeat offenses.

a better way to look at it is, what is the judge's goal, and how can you help him achieve that goal? otherwise, playing a game of cat and mouse risks angering the judge, and just like you can't help but hide your activity, he won't be able to help but deny your motions.

I also am reminded of weev. weev went to jail. SBF is out on bail, with conditions. If he can't meet the conditions, the alternative is choosing jail.

Re: Judge orders SBF to stop using VPNs [pdf]

#7

Post by kayodelycaon »

kurisufag wrote: post #4

I am skeptical that the Judge (or whoever else was involved here) understands what precisely they're talking about. By my reading, HTTPS would also violate the order, and there isn't anything you can do with an explicit VPN protocol that you can't do with a day or two of infra setup using another technology. I am reminded of when weev set up services for himself so prison phone calls to a particular number would be a…

The law isn’t a computer program and nor does it care about technical hair-splitting. The order is saying use of a VPN for chat/call purposes is violating an existing ban on using encrypted or ephemeral chat/call programs.

Basically, he is not allowed to have secret communications with people.

For a specific example: Facebook messenger uses SSL, but law enforcement can easily request records of what he said. Being able to get the content of those messages is what’s important here.

Re: Judge orders SBF to stop using VPNs [pdf]

#8

Post by anigbrowl »

macinjosh wrote: post #3
LatteLazy wrote: post #2

On the one hand it's nice judges are patient and lean towards liberty. On the other hand people who keep blatantly, knowingly breaking bail conditions should go to jail.

I don't like the guy but if the judge had to amend the bail conditions to exclude VPNs did he really break the bail conditions in the first place by using a VPN? It was a gray area that has been clarified by the judge. That's all really.

Oh nonsense. This is just an attempt at hacking the legal system by playing definition games. It's like being told not to shoplift and argue that you never touched anyone else's goods because you wore gloves the whole time. His lawyers just responded to the allegation by trying to turn it into a basis for negotiation.
Post reply on HN