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Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

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Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#121

Post by NDizzle »

duffyjp wrote: post #96
scotty79 wrote: post #27

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A lot of people who own plug-in hybrids don't really ever plug them in which makes them worse than gasoline cars or non-plugin hybrids because of added weight.

My wife had a plug-in Ford C-Max Energi for a few years. We always plugged it in but it only did ~20 miles on pure EV so long term our mileage was around 40MPG. My Prius easily beats that and I'm not paying an extra $20 a month on my electric bill. You're right though, when we bought it according the the computer the previous owner had never charged it. The charge cable wasn't even out of it's plastic. When we sold i…

There's a sweet spot that Ford missed with the C-Max.

I have a 2nd gen Volt. 50-60 miles on all electric when it's warm, 30-40 when it's cold. That, by the way, will bite a lot of people in the ass as they try EVs.

Anyways, 62,000 miles on the Volt, lifetime MPG is in the 170s.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#122

Post by NDizzle »

chris222 wrote: post #34
cma wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the batteries in each EV, you could make 7 plug-in hybrids. That's 1 full electric and 6 gas cars, vs 7 plug-in hybrids. I think Toyota's approach would save more emissions so long as we are battery constrained.

This was true several years ago but if you look now there are hundreds of GWh of cell plants coming online over the next 3 years. Toyota is very late here and won’t be able to produce dedicated BEVs at scale until 2026+. Competitors will already be on their 2nd or 3rd generation BEV platforms by then.

2nd or 3rd generation anything will still score lower than even a launch year Toyota when it comes to quality.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#123

Post by scrlk »

ethbr0 wrote: post #15
neoromantique wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are there though? Toyota is never perceived as a luxury brand, it is associated with quality, reliability and maintainability. Something that you can hardly say about Apple.

They didn't distribute most of their luxury platforms worldwide. E.g. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Toyota_Century

The Century is such a wonderfully understated car. The European equivalent would probably be something like a VW Phaeton with the W12 engine.

This marketing video from Toyota on the 2nd gen Century is a good summary: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=s1erJ1eVmLo

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#124

Post by _huayra_ »

switch007 wrote: post #100
qclibre22 wrote: post #57

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.consumerreports.org/car-reliability-owner-satisf... : "Toyota, Lexus, and BMW are the top three most reliable brands in our annual auto reliability brand rankings" https://www.forbes.com/wheels/news/consumer-reports-reliabil... : 5 of top 10 are Toyota

BMW, number 3?! They must build them different in the US, surely.

BMW = "Bring My Wallet" because those multi-thousand $$$ shocks won't replace themselves for free after 4 years

In the US it seems like they're built to barely make it to the end of the leasing period and then implode. They're really going to town with the "snap-in" fittings for hoses in the engine because putting a metal hose clamp on seems to increase COGS I guess.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#125

Post by [deleted] »

clouddrover wrote: post #56
speedgoose wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But Toyota isn’t on top of the reliability rankings.

Toyota scored 1st and 2nd (Toyota and Lexus) in Consumers reports 2022 reliability rankings: https://www.consumerreports.org/car-reliability-owner-satisf... Lexus is number one in JD Power's 2023 rankings: https://www.jdpower.com/business/press-releases/2023-us-vehi...

[deleted]

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#127

Post by [deleted] »

qclibre22 wrote: post #57
speedgoose wrote: post #49

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But Toyota isn’t on top of the reliability rankings.

https://www.consumerreports.org/car-reliability-owner-satisf... : "Toyota, Lexus, and BMW are the top three most reliable brands in our annual auto reliability brand rankings" https://www.forbes.com/wheels/news/consumer-reports-reliabil... : 5 of top 10 are Toyota

[deleted]

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#128

Post by duffyjp »

NDizzle wrote: post #121
duffyjp wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My wife had a plug-in Ford C-Max Energi for a few years. We always plugged it in but it only did ~20 miles on pure EV so long term our mileage was around 40MPG. My Prius easily beats that and I'm not paying an extra $20 a month on my electric bill. You're right though, when we bought it according the the computer the previous owner had never charged it. The charge cable wasn't even out of it's plastic. When we sold i…

There's a sweet spot that Ford missed with the C-Max. I have a 2nd gen Volt. 50-60 miles on all electric when it's warm, 30-40 when it's cold. That, by the way, will bite a lot of people in the ass as they try EVs. Anyways, 62,000 miles on the Volt, lifetime MPG is in the 170s.

I think the key is the Volt was designed to be a great plug in hybrid from the start. The C-Max had an ICE only, standard hybrid, and plug-in hybrid version. Our plug-in literally had two separate high voltage batteries. Half the cargo bay was just a carpeted box full of batteries.

It was also terribly engineered. Plugging the car into the wall didn't top off the 12V battery and whatever mechanism it used to do so was inadequate so you'd go out in the morning to a stone dead car quite often. The number of recalls was insane, though we got a lot of free oil changes out of that as the dealer usually threw them in free during recall services.

First and last Ford I'll ever buy.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#129

Post by speedgoose »

speedgoose wrote: post #49
urduntupu wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Toyota is building one of the most reliable and robust cars for the masses. With attitude to build cars they will be competitive for very long.

But Toyota isn’t on top of the reliability rankings.

My bad, I got a wrong source.

Re: Shoichiro Toyoda, who turned Toyota into global automaker, has died

#130

Post by dsfyu404ed »

_huayra_ wrote: post #124
switch007 wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

BMW, number 3?! They must build them different in the US, surely.

BMW = "Bring My Wallet" because those multi-thousand $$$ shocks won't replace themselves for free after 4 years In the US it seems like they're built to barely make it to the end of the leasing period and then implode. They're really going to town with the "snap-in" fittings for hoses in the engine because putting a metal hose clamp on seems to increase COGS I guess.

> They're really going to town with the "snap-in" fittings for hoses in the engine because putting a metal hose clamp on seems to increase COGS

It's a labor saving thing. It's cheaper to design a fancy snap-together plastic connector once, buy a few million from overseas and than it is to have expensive first world labor tighten hose clamps.

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