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Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

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Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#111
post #79

When interest rates are 0%, any amount of growth compounded over years is attractive. When you can get a 5% risk-free return from treasuries, even 7% rate of return is unattractive when compared to the safest asset on earth returning 5%. My point is, layoffs will continue until companies are much more efficient, or interest rates go down.

layoffs will continue until companies are much more efficient DO made a profit of a little over $250m in 2022, on revenue of $428.6m. That's a 60% margin. How much efficiency does a company need? EDIT: Correction.. those are the 2021 numbers. The latest numbers on the DO website for Q3 2022 state; " Gross profit of $97.6 million or 64% of revenue, an increase of 300 basis points year-over-year, and adjusted gross pro…

Wow. If a company has to layoff with those numbers, that is insane. I guess the Venture Market demands that or it is just a ploy to get rid of low performers in general. I wonder.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wild to think a country can have both too much employment and millions living below the poverty line.

Not everyone has the same skills and capabilities. Also the poverty line is a moving target. People with streaming TV and video game consoles are technically in poverty in the US. In the 1960-70s, access to those items would be only for ultra wealthy.

You mean non-existent. The Atari 2600 came out in 1977 and it's very difficult to have streaming TV without the internet, which came about in the 80s and 90s.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#113

Hearing that a lot of Community teams were let go, including the teams responsible for tutorials. Seems obvious DigitalOcean doesn't care about developers anymore. But this has been obvious for a while now. I guess their value "Our Community is bigger than just us" only matters when profits are up. Pour one out for DigitalOcean. It's the end of an era.

I knew it was only a matter of time once they went public.

> I knew it was only a matter of time once they went public.

Very common. "This was a great place for an engineer to work. Then the MBAs came..."

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#114
post #68

Have been a mostly happy DO customer for some time. Would be interested to know if the layoffs were carried off skillfully/compassionately or messily/carelessly.

Never lose your 2FA backup codes or you're locked out of your account forever if you lose your 2FA device - despite support having a verification process to remove 2FA in the event you lost your codes - the support tickets are ignored or unmonitored. I was also a happy DO customer for the last 5 years or so. But now I'm locked out of my account. My fault for losing my codes (DO are the only backup codes I can't seem…

I had this happen in 2018 and had no trouble getting my account back. The support agent requested pictures of me with documents -- front of credit card used as payment method + passport -- and then disabled 2FA on my account.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#115
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> My point is, layoffs will continue until companies are much more efficient, or interest rates go down. Exactly what the FED wanted.

how does interest rate affects company layoffs and why is being more efficient affects that? and why would FED want this? - serious question

The Fed doesn't want layoffs – at least not directly. I'll give you the accepted economist explanation rather than my own, but I would note there is a serious lack of independent thinking in economic circles. It's like these people are all educated in the same elite universities reading the same textbooks – as an outsider the level of group think in economics is utterly bizarre.

Now that disclaimer is out of the way...

So the Fed has three mandates (in theory), minimize unemployment, keep inflation low and stable, ensure moderate interest rates.

Inflation in an economy is always caused by supply and demand dynamics. If there's a lot of demand for something but not enough supply then prices will rise until an equilibrium is reached. Rapid changes in prices is something the Fed is mandated to tackle.

The Fed as a central bank can't really do anything to change how many goods / services businesses are supplying so all they can really do to control prices (inflation) is influence demand.

I won't get into the details of all the ways they can do this here, but to summerise they basically have a few really crap tools, with the primary one being to increase interest rates – not 100% true, but close enough. This has the impact of making it more attractive for consumers to save, rather than spend (basically).

More saving and less spending means lower demand for goods, and therefore inflation should fall back to target. The opposite is true when the Fed wants inflation to be higher. The Fed wanting more inflation was why interest rates have been so low in recent years. One of the consequences of lower demand is that businesses may need to slow hiring, or cut jobs.

Their mandate on employment and moderate interest rates largely stems from low and stable interest rates. This is because employment and interest rates are mostly a product of growth dynamics and the only way the Fed can encourage long-term growth is by ensuring prices in the economy are stable and accommodative to long-term decision making.

When people say the Fed wants unemployment what they mean is that the Fed wants people to stop spending money so they stop bidding up the price of goods and services in the economny. Historically tight labour markets (as we have now) correlate well with robust economic demand, and therefore higher inflation. This is partly because consumers have jobs and can spend, but also because in a tight labour market businesses have to compete for labour so consumers tend to get pay rises easier too.

I'm skipping over a ton here, so feel free to ask if there's anything you're unclear on. But basically the Fed wants you to lose your job so you'll stop spending money and so businesses don't have to compete as aggressively for labour. In theory, this is good for long-term growth dynamics.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#117

When interest rates are 0%, any amount of growth compounded over years is attractive. When you can get a 5% risk-free return from treasuries, even 7% rate of return is unattractive when compared to the safest asset on earth returning 5%. My point is, layoffs will continue until companies are much more efficient, or interest rates go down.

> When you can get a 5% risk-free return from treasuries, even 7% rate of return is unattractive when compared to the safest asset on earth returning 5%. I got news for you. The riskiest place to park your money right now is government bonds. Long-dated US treasuries are risky. You will end up losing everything. But if you insist on US treasuries, be my guest. I need someone to trade against.

I’ve seen some fascinating stuff on this site, but someone claiming to trade against T-Bills is hilarious.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#118
post #89
post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tech workers are a small portion of workers overall

You are correct. The FED is not targeting tech workers as implied above; they do not have a granular "toolkit" at their disposal. Although workers in growth industries will be harder hit due to valuations being based on future cash flows.

I never implied the Fed is targeting tech. I said rates hikes are used to minimize asset inflation caused by speculation driven by the top 10% of Americans. Tech is just overrepresented in that top 10%.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#119
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For the uninitiated, this is a reference to the infamous "The beatings will continue until morale improves."

Explaining the joke is not helpful at all.

Explaining a riff that most haven't heard of a joke that isn't all that common actually seems extremely helpful.

Re: Tell HN: DigitalOcean is doing layoffs

#120

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Wild to think a country can have both too much employment and millions living below the poverty line.

Not everyone has the same skills and capabilities. Also the poverty line is a moving target. People with streaming TV and video game consoles are technically in poverty in the US. In the 1960-70s, access to those items would be only for ultra wealthy.

>Also the poverty line is a moving target. People with streaming TV and video game consoles are technically in poverty in the US

Yea, this is a tricky one. Is there something below poverty? Googling it says the poverty line is $35,801 for a family. I have relatives in a foreign country that would die for $35k (even all things relative). They have a TV but that's about it. No streaming, no reliable cell phones, etc. All through college and even a bit before, I would have lived in what was considered poverty... but to say "I lived in poverty" just sounds silly.

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