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Nicola Sturgeon to resign as Scotland's first minister

bbc.co.uk

11–20 of 45 posts

Re: Nicola Sturgeon to resign as Scotland's first minister

#11

As an Englishman, I've been impressed with how mature and competent the Scottish leaders have seemed in comparison with their English counterparts; I don't know if it's a systemic or cultural thing (or just my imagination), but as a representative of that tendency I'm sad to see her go.

My hobby horse is more representative voting systems and the one in place in Scotland encourages people to aim for broad suppport rather than be loved and hated by a minority.

Re: Nicola Sturgeon to resign as Scotland's first minister

#14
post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree that women have seemed relatively impressive at the top when they have stuck compared to their male counterparts; again, I don't know if that is coincidental, or representative of something we should learn from.

Theresa May is certainly the exception on that list. She's widely regarded (next to Liz Truss) as one of the most ineffectual Prime Ministers of the last fifty years.

As terrible as May was, it does seem that a lot of the derision toward her is rooted in either scapegoating (from the Conservative side) or - more commonly - misogyny (from all sides).

She certainly was not competent, and did a lot of damage, but she doesn't compare to the incompetence of either her predecessor or successor. It's also worth noting that she was handed a poison chalice: the Brexit mandate, which she had been opposed to during the original referendum, and subsequently blamed for every predictable misstep in implementation (mostly by Johnson, who had shied away from the leadership role in the immediate wake of the referendum, despite being an instigator).

Either way you look at it, she was saddled with a lot of blame for problems that predated her office.

Re: Nicola Sturgeon to resign as Scotland's first minister

#15
post #4

Last of my "4 Favs" is gone, shame. May, Merkel, Ardern and Sturgeon.

The list makes no sense - revealing your motives.

I wouldn't include May (see my reply to a sibling comment), but otherwise the only other person that seems slightly odd in that list is Merkel for being a christian conservative, but - even as a leftist - she's still one of the only one leaders I can think of that I would actually respect the integrity of (individual political stances aside). So the list seems relatively sound.

I presume you're seeing gender when you say "motives" & otherwise ignoring any actual substance of these leaderships?

I'm genuinely struggling to think of any male leaders I would add to the list - Hollande is a contender but there's a lot of issues there. Open to any suggestions for the list...

Re: Nicola Sturgeon to resign as Scotland's first minister

#16
post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Ironically, I was always very impressed with Salmond as well, he seemed to be on a different level, wit and intelligence wise to his English colleagues. It all obviously got a bit grimy with him and Sturgeon at the end, so I didn't mention it. There has also been the recent trans policy heat (not to say she is on the wrong side, I have no idea) and the finance debacle that Private Eye has been tracking. So yes, they…

With regards to Scottish politics and its politicians, I suspect you are allowing yourself to bathe in the rays of your own ignorance.

Ha, well I did have the misfortune the other day to stumble on to a piece in The National and was depressed at the blatant anti-Englishness, especially in the toxic comments, which would have been condemned as racism with any other target or in any other mainstream publication.

Re: Nicola Sturgeon to resign as Scotland's first minister

#17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The list makes no sense - revealing your motives.

I wouldn't include May (see my reply to a sibling comment), but otherwise the only other person that seems slightly odd in that list is Merkel for being a christian conservative, but - even as a leftist - she's still one of the only one leaders I can think of that I would actually respect the integrity of (individual political stances aside). So the list seems relatively sound. I presume you're seeing gender when you…

Margaret Thatcher? I personally don't agree with all her ideas, but she has rescued the UK out of the mess they were in in the early '80s, and she managed to do it in an extremely hostile environment.

Re: Nicola Sturgeon to resign as Scotland's first minister

#18

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I wouldn't include May (see my reply to a sibling comment), but otherwise the only other person that seems slightly odd in that list is Merkel for being a christian conservative, but - even as a leftist - she's still one of the only one leaders I can think of that I would actually respect the integrity of (individual political stances aside). So the list seems relatively sound. I presume you're seeing gender when you…

Margaret Thatcher? I personally don't agree with all her ideas, but she has rescued the UK out of the mess they were in in the early '80s, and she managed to do it in an extremely hostile environment.

If you're having a discussion with people who like Sturgeon & Ardern, who have some issues with Merkel & May, raising one of the most hated women in recent history seems an unusual take.

Thatcher (& Reagan) are rightly recognised today as being responsible for untold suffering. Even the UK Conservative party (Hague) have since spoken out against her approach.

She didn't "rescue" the UK from anything, unless when you say "UK" you exclusively mean "UK shareholders". Her policies caused skyrocketing unemployment & poverty, the only positives anyone has cited were macroeconomic & even Blair thought those changes resulted from societal shifts rather than from Thatcher's political interventions.

The environment was reactively hostile - the hostilities more than justified.

Re: Nicola Sturgeon to resign as Scotland's first minister

#19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To be honest, in comparison to the last 5 years of the Tory part, Sturgeon is quite competent. The only proper scandal I remember is the Salmond case, and then in terms of being incompetent the only thing which is undisputable is how badly she has handled the Scottish drug policy/crisis.

Ironically, I was always very impressed with Salmond as well, he seemed to be on a different level, wit and intelligence wise to his English colleagues. It all obviously got a bit grimy with him and Sturgeon at the end, so I didn't mention it. There has also been the recent trans policy heat (not to say she is on the wrong side, I have no idea) and the finance debacle that Private Eye has been tracking. So yes, they…

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Re: Nicola Sturgeon to resign as Scotland's first minister

#20

As an Englishman, I've been impressed with how mature and competent the Scottish leaders have seemed in comparison with their English counterparts; I don't know if it's a systemic or cultural thing (or just my imagination), but as a representative of that tendency I'm sad to see her go.

My hobby horse is more representative voting systems and the one in place in Scotland encourages people to aim for broad suppport rather than be loved and hated by a minority.

How does it do that? Some sort of ranked choice?
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