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Why I'm a Pirate

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Re: Why I'm a Pirate

#91

Post by JumpCrisscross »

tintin wrote: post #70
JumpCrisscross wrote: post #45

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"You can't just copy a car." Yup! And that's why comparing digital piracy with car theft is also equally silly. Note, I don't have a hard stance on this. Counterfeiting drugs, etc. is wrong for obvious reasons. Coming up with a similar argument for entertainment media is a bit less tenable. When the MPAA and RIAA cede the moral high ground by acting like idiots (suing 12-year olds, pushing for high criminal charges,…

I was comparing the laws of theft. It's just the law that a copyright owner can ask whatever for it. When you obtain a copy without flowing this rule it is called theft. So I think the discussion should be about the copyright law. Not about "I think this service sucks so I will get an illegal copy". Don't get me wrong. I think it's absurd that you can get a penalty of $10.000 for downloading a MP3. I think the copyri…

Laws aren't absolute; they are, when properly written, the codification of social mores. Presently, copyright law conflates copying with theft, you are correct in this. But I think the meta-debate surrounding the issue is whether this assumption is correct; it is thus circular to cite the law as one's defence.

"I think it's silly to fight a law by disobeying it"

I agree with the sentiment that this should not be a first response. But if the intent is to deprive the studios of revenue while sticking a finger to them with the intention of encouraging them to back down, then it is a valid strategy (with precedence). Given the radicalisation of the MPAA, however, I don't see that as being likely.

So I agree with you in practice, but diverge in principle.

Re: Why I'm a Pirate

#92

Post by tomp »

hendrik-xdest wrote: post #72
tomp wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So, does this tax then mean that I can pirate songs/movies? After all, I have already paid for them (through the tax). (Fiction, I know, but one can dream...)

The concept is a bit different, at the moment. Creating copies of copyrighted material _could_ be possible with scanners, printers, CD and DVD burners ... The fee you pay on those and other devices is rather to pay for illegal copies that are created of copyrighted material you own. Not for creating hardcopies of illegally acquired content. At least that is what is supposed to do. In reality ... well you might want t…

Isn't it you fair use right to create copies of things you already own? E.g. for backup, or for your own music compilations, ...

Re: Why I'm a Pirate

#93

Post by mgkimsal »

bad_user wrote: post #83
mgkimsal wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

"Copyright infringement is not stealing." Sure, let's have a very pedentic notion of stealing and keeping framing the debate around 'stealing'. OK... "taking something which isn't yours and/or you don't have permission to take". In most minds, that's the same as stealing, hence the standard use of the word 'stealing'. But substitute the phrase above for 'stealing' and, imo, it becomes harder to justify. Just because…

Here's a history of copyright law: - Copyright Act of 1790 - established U.S. copyright with term of 14 years with 14-year renewal - Copyright Act of 1831 - extended the term to 28 years with 14-year renewal - Copyright Act of 1909 - extended term to 28 years with 28-year renewal - Copyright Act of 1976 - extended term to either 75 years or life of author plus 50 years - Copyright Renewal Act of 1992 removed the requ…

Again, not really saying anything about the "right" or "wrong" aspects, but continually using the word "stealing" in the debate, then debunking it by comparing it to a car, is, at best, a strawman argument. Unfortunately, I'm not sure there's a better/easier one word description people can use (for soundbiteness) that adequately gets the point across that the major industries are trying to get across.

Re: Why I'm a Pirate

#94

Post by tomp »

mgkimsal wrote: post #69
tomp wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Copyright infringement is not stealing. I assume there will be counter-arguments/downvotes, so to elaborate on this point using my own arguments: If you steal something from me, I don't have it (as in "steal a car"), so you're putting me in a worse-off position. If you copy/pirate something that is mine (properly copy, with attribution, and not out of context), I am not worse-off (possibly even better-off, as I get…

"Copyright infringement is not stealing." Sure, let's have a very pedentic notion of stealing and keeping framing the debate around 'stealing'. OK... "taking something which isn't yours and/or you don't have permission to take". In most minds, that's the same as stealing, hence the standard use of the word 'stealing'. But substitute the phrase above for 'stealing' and, imo, it becomes harder to justify. Just because…

> "taking something which isn't yours..."

It's not taking, either.

Re: Why I'm a Pirate

#95

Post by tomp »

Tyrannosaurs wrote: post #90
tomp wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Copyright infringement is not stealing. I assume there will be counter-arguments/downvotes, so to elaborate on this point using my own arguments: If you steal something from me, I don't have it (as in "steal a car"), so you're putting me in a worse-off position. If you copy/pirate something that is mine (properly copy, with attribution, and not out of context), I am not worse-off (possibly even better-off, as I get…

OK, how would you feel if the person who owned your apartment before you came in with a key he still had while you were out and sat in your bedroom in the dark (not using power) playing with himself? You're not using your flat, it's there anyway, you've not lost anything, nothing has been broken or damaged, he's gone before you're back so it's fine right?

This is more a question of privacy than of "stealing"/"not paying". In a world where privacy didn't exist (i.e. there would be no "reasonable expectations of privacy", I wouldn't mind.

Let's use another example. I order food, but don't eat all I get. If you will eat it, I would be very glad, as it wouldn't go to waste.

Re: Why I'm a Pirate

#96

Post by Historiopode »

zalthor wrote: post #17

When I was living in the United states I was able to use services like Netflix and spotify and get the content I wanted whenever I wanted where ever I wanted. Now, I that live in India, I cannot get that content legally. I cannot watch the TV shows I want to watch as they are aired (I have to wait 2-3 years for stuff to come on TV). The ONLY option I have is to download tv shows via torrents / find some online stream…

Europe is the same, indeed. I wish general and regional distribution issues received more attention when discussing piracy, the latter point standing despite (this) web being US-centric. Publishers deliberately introduce artificious policies, while outdated and unsynchronized legislations contribute to hinder positive efforts. The eventual result for the end-user who is not living the God-Blessed American Way is an imperscrutable buffer of tedious, incoherent obstacles – all of which are easily overcame with piracy, which plainly offers a better experience. This is particularly true for the movie and TV industry, while music and software seem to be gradually improving. This particular issue, however, stems from deeper localist inadequacies that, I suspect, might start to influence things more significant than our entertainment, such as upcoming payment services (e.g. Stripe, which is currently locked-in the US); they are already proving troublesome for financial and fiscal activities. Briefly said: while the Internet is a naturally global technology, middle-men are mostly attempting to costrain it to fit their previous business models. This is, I reckon, both terrible for service quality – and, more theatrically, a wasted chance for progressing part of our cultures past petty nationalisms.

Re: Why I'm a Pirate

#97

Post by wladimir »

Silhouette wrote: post #79
wladimir wrote: post #56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exactly. A prostitute performs a personal service for you. Not paying directly hurts him/her. When copying information on the other hand, nothing happens, you don't feel it when your information is copied. (yes, you can say it does indirectly through some convoluted story, but that's always debatable) The future economy will be more about directly personalized experiences and services that cannot be copied, or are mu…

> When copying information on the other hand, nothing happens, you don't feel it when your information is copied. But you surely felt the months of work that went into writing your book in the first place, or the months of practice that allowed you to give that one great performance in the recording studio. > It is all about scarcity. Some of us prefer quality to quantity. Sadly, producing good quality usually requir…

Some of us prefer quality to quantity. Sadly, producing good quality usually requires a significant amount of hard work, and that isn't going to change any time soon.

You just validated my point. The people that prefer quality still pay for people to work (hard?) for them. Without needing any violent enforcement or censorship.

Don't fetishize information, focus on what you (and other people) can do with it. Until brain patterns can be copied (if ever), skill and experience will still be scarce.

Re: Why I'm a Pirate

#98

Post by baq »

true_religion wrote: post #29

I've always wondered what odd confusion of emotions could make someone say they are a thief and proud of it. I can understand those who claim that what they are doing isn't thievery. I can understand those that don't accept the idea of intellectual property in general. But for you to both buy into the philosophy that what you are taking is valuable, and ought to be protected---then still steal it proudly..... that is…

what if you believe being a thief is a good thing?

Re: Why I'm a Pirate

#99

Post by ewams »

Has anyone else noticed all of the "I had to" or "There was no other option" for their rational? It sounds like you are addicted to drugs! Is the media you are consuming really that good? Do you have to take a hit everyday? Are you addicted to TV, movies and music? Sure sounds like it to me.

Re: Why I'm a Pirate

#100

Post by fauigerzigerk »

Tichy wrote: post #26
gavinballard wrote: post #16

This is a series of pretty poor arguments. The author seems to be looking for reasons to justify their own piracy and conflates anger at the approach of the "copyright industry" with infringement upon peoples' rights. One of the final lines of the article, in particular, is jarring: "If I'm a pirate, it's not to have some cheap music. It is because the time has come for you to fuck off." It's fine to be angry about t…

"with infringement upon peoples' rights" People's rights are man made, so they are debatable.

Absolutely, but the counter argument is that the conclusion of that debate is expressed by the law, which is supposed to be the will of the people.

You could of course make the case that our democracy is too imperfect to accept the letter of any particular law as a direct expression of the will of the people without applying your further judgement.

Laws can be inconsistent, unjust or inappropriately applied and that's why we have the courts to make those judgements. Unfortunately, access to the courts is very unequal, particularly in the case of civil law. It's always been like this, hence breaking the law has always been the poor man's expensive lawyer and lobbyist at the same time.

Of course this argument could be used as a blanket excuse for breaking any law. Personal judgement just can't be replaced by any system.

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