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US aircraft shoots down new airborne object over Canada

bbc.com

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Re: US aircraft shoots down new airborne object over Canada

#281

Post by laidoffamazon »

crayboff wrote: post #238
c3534l wrote: post #226

I wonder if they're trying to figure out what we can detect and we're giving them all the information they need by publically shooting these down.

I'm convinced that's why the balloons haven't been shot down in the past. Learning our detection abilities is probably way more important for China than anything they would be able to take a picture of.

We spent multiple days soaking information from them and monitoring them from high altitude. We almost definitely know more about them than they know about our defenses.

The immediate assumption that the Americans are being snookered comes off like reflexive anti-Americanism.

Re: US aircraft shoots down new airborne object over Canada

#282

Post by RajT88 »

jahewson wrote: post #260
c3534l wrote: post #226

I wonder if they're trying to figure out what we can detect and we're giving them all the information they need by publically shooting these down.

If you’ve got it, flaunt it.

My gut feeling, having read all about how the balloon was NBD, and it wasn't worth the risk of shooting down over land, it happens all the time, etc., was that the publicity of an airspace incursion this time around required a response along the lines of, "F*CK YOUR BALLOON!".

Re: US aircraft shoots down new airborne object over Canada

#283

Post by AlbertCory »

crayboff wrote: post #268
AlbertCory wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, I don't think that's it. Detecting a balloon doesn't take any exotic technology. Now a hypersonic missile, or a stealth plane -- that would be a test. But losing one of those would be pretty expensive.

I suspect finding a small balloon in the mind-boggling huge space that is American airspace is, can be surprisingly challenging. My understanding is that these UAFs are much smaller than that first Chinese balloon last week. It probably also costs a lot more money to shoot down a balloon than it costs China to put a balloon in the air.

I'm not a radar expert, but maybe someone who is can enlighten us?

They can detect an incoming missile, so I don't see the problem. Maybe the one today IS a lot smaller; I don't think we're getting a whole lot of details on that.

As for the money: definitely. The same would be true of drones.

Re: US aircraft shoots down new airborne object over Canada

#284

Post by laidoffamazon »

crayboff wrote: post #270
mc32 wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

People can see these with the naked eye (or with cameras). If our sophisticated defense systems are failing to match the naked eye... something is wrong.

My understanding is that only the balloon from last week was huge and easy to see with the human eye. I believe the other UAFs are much smaller. Also there were 3 or 4 during the Trump administration and noone noticed them with their naked eye

People think they notice lots of things with their naked eyes all the time and it doesn't make the news. Reports this week were that they didn't detect them in transit at the time, we only found out after the fact.

Another plausible theory is the Trump administration covered it up because of their deference to Xi in early 2020 (see: comments on COVID being under control).

Re: US aircraft shoots down new airborne object over Canada

#286

Post by RajT88 »

dumbaccount123 wrote: post #190

"Some pilots said the object “interfered with their sensors” on the planes" "Some pilots also claimed to have seen no identifiable propulsion on the object, and could not explain how it was staying in the air, despite the object cruising at an altitude of 40,000 feet." https://www.cnn.com/2023/02/11/politics/unidentified-object-... "It was described as "cylindrical and silver-ish gray" and seemed to be floating, a U.…

Before we jump to alien spacecraft, the US Government was quite forthcoming about this even, so let's see what they say when they gather up all the wreckage and analyze it.

We're rolling into an election season, and the minority party loves conspiracies. I have a good feeling that information will be shared shortly about what they shot down.

Re: US aircraft shoots down new airborne object over Canada

#287

Post by laidoffamazon »

c3534l wrote: post #226

I wonder if they're trying to figure out what we can detect and we're giving them all the information they need by publically shooting these down.

I think its usually a bad bet to assume to know better than military intelligence that has been circling these balloons for several days now (and yes, they were right about Iraq, it just was ignored as pretext to invade)

Re: US aircraft shoots down new airborne object over Canada

#288

Post by [deleted] »

oceliker wrote: post #141
ksherlock wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> There's no hard rule about where national airspace ends and space begins What does that have to do with the price of tea in China? There's no hard rule about when life begins but killing a 5 year old isn't a 22nd trimester abortion, it's murder. 18-60'000 feet is class A, controlled airspace in the US and Canada. When the US sent U2s over the USSR, the rationale wasn't that 70,000 feet was "space", it was that it w…

> What does that have to do with the price of tea in China? What does this mean? I don’t see a reference to tea in the comment you are replying to.

[deleted]

Re: US aircraft shoots down new airborne object over Canada

#289

Post by 1over137 »

tempestn wrote: post #274
1over137 wrote: post #265

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I did read the article, yes. It was the US plane that did the actual take down. Of course RCAF planes joined, how much more pathetic would it have been if only foreign planes did the work. Did Canadian planes join in the other day when the Alaska one was shot down? Of course not, because the USAF is able to do it on their own, unlike the RCAF, which was my original point.

Because that's how it's supposed to work. The US and Canada work together to defend their combined airspace. They're literally under the same chain of command, hence "NORAD". It would be rather inefficient to set that up and then have both countries redundantly responding everywhere.

I'm familiar with NORAD. Take a look at Canadian media, you'll see they are talking about the fact RCAF could not do it on their own.

Re: US aircraft shoots down new airborne object over Canada

#290

Post by ErikCorry »

graphe wrote: post #253

UFOs are just spy drones with sensor jammers and detectors that are designed to look strange and unnerving to pilots so they will scope them out. Pilots are trained NOT to go by them or engage with them for fear of secrets leaking.

That seems like the best explanation. See https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/40054/adversary-drones... for a fleshed out version of that argument.

I think what changed is that the US decided to stop ignoring the "UFO"s. The Ukraine war has shown how important drones are and it's obvious that drones and balloons will play a huge role in any Taiwanese war.

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