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Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

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Re: Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

#611

Post by throwawayyy9237 »

65 wrote: post #523
trentnix wrote: post #144

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's quite simple: If you don't follow the herd, you risk being blamed if you fail. But if you follow the herd and do what everyone else is doing, even if the herd runs off of a cliff, nobody points any fingers. You'd think somewhere, in at least one of these larger tech companies, there would be a leader boldly proclaiming "this is our time to increase our investments and beat our competitors!" But it turns out ther…

Nobody ever gets fired for buying IBM.

Exactly what came to mind.

If you do what everybody else does, you can blame outside factors if it goes wrong.

If you decide to be the one that _doesn't_ follow the trend, if it goes wrong, the blame falls on you.

Re: Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

#612

Post by blagie »

SergeAx wrote: post #604
blagie wrote: post #592

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A manager's primary responsibilities are: - to find a way to keep their job through layoffs - to find a way to move up to director - to have fun at work - to maintain work-life balance ... and so on.

Manager should deliver on time and budget in order to keep their job. It is easier to do having performing team. Performing team consists of performing ICs. Easy as that.

A performing team helps!

On the whole, though, it's easiest to do that with low expectation setting. If I can convince management that what my team is doing is Very Hard and Very Important, my team will be perceived as high-performing. Unless the CEO is sitting in on sprints, except for extreme cases, they won't know better.

If you're in a large corporation, and your team does more with less, but your director constantly sees the output of another team, who gets laid off at the next layoffs? As a manager, how are the incentives split between managing your reports, and managing your director, the CEO, and the rest of the org?

This problem isn't specific to management. It's any time you've set up incentive structures, from teaching-to-the-test at schools, to how we select the CEO themselves.

Re: Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

#613

Post by alldayeveryday »

A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #608
alldayeveryday wrote: post #603

Earlier quoted context omitted.

To your point about services reduction, I don't agree. I think more of a re-allocation of where capitol is going is the cure. We should increase or create new social programs that incentivize native births, home ownership, making it possible for most households to have just one person in the workforce, etc - and reduce the money that goes towards foreign wars, foreign agitation, welfare for nations across the world,…

I disagree. The only way to even begin thinking about selling it to the public, which happens to include moneyed interests is 'shared sacrifice' ( similar to how a war effort would be sold ). In pure mathematical terms, we really should be doing both already. We don't because things did not get bad enough yet, but once it starts, it will be a little hard to stop. Shock therapy is necessary to get things under control…

> … is shared sacrifice similar to how a war effort is sold.

You actually posed a solution here not a disproof. Yes all this requires selling changes to the public and under a social message. One doesn’t need math to know this, it is intuitively true.

> from where to where

I already answered this.

> re-allocation is not going to happen because even the current allocation was a result of heavy compromise.

So anything that requires compromise cannot be undone? I’m not tracking your logic here.

I think you are looking for more evidence to backup my suggestion. See 1930s Germany as example where this model was followed and resulted in one of the greatest economic turnarounds of all time.

> inb4 muh nazis and Holocaust

Doesn’t disprove the economic turnaround that transpired.

Re: Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

#614

Post by alldayeveryday »

noelsusman wrote: post #610
alldayeveryday wrote: post #602

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Inflation began to spike in the U.S. in April of 2021, when it hit 4.2%. Inflation continued to climb, hitting 7% year-over-year by December 2021. Sadly, 2022 didn’t see any slowdown in inflation as the rate peaked at 9.1% in June. Starting in July, inflation began to fall slightly, though it still sat at 7.7% in November. Your atlantafed link shows unweighted wage increase peaking at 6.7% in August 2022. In what way…

Click on the button to separate by wage level. Wage growth for the bottom 50% has significantly outpaced wage growth for the top 50%. Their wages grew at around 7.3% over the last 12 months, which outpaces inflation. It may have been a bit under when inflation was at its peak, so it's possible they just came out even with inflation overall, which is still pretty good when you're doubling your net worth at the same ti…

Wages peaked at 7.3%, not averaged that over the 12 month period.

Re: Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

#615

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

alldayeveryday wrote: post #613
A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #608

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I disagree. The only way to even begin thinking about selling it to the public, which happens to include moneyed interests is 'shared sacrifice' ( similar to how a war effort would be sold ). In pure mathematical terms, we really should be doing both already. We don't because things did not get bad enough yet, but once it starts, it will be a little hard to stop. Shock therapy is necessary to get things under control…

> … is shared sacrifice similar to how a war effort is sold. You actually posed a solution here not a disproof. Yes all this requires selling changes to the public and under a social message. One doesn’t need math to know this, it is intuitively true. > from where to where I already answered this. > re-allocation is not going to happen because even the current allocation was a result of heavy compromise. So anything…

I am convinced, just about anything can be done given enough effort, time and money. That said, how much of those would have to be expended to undo current compromise status quo? I personally would venture a lot more than most people would be willing to give in exchange.

Um.. yes, because US just happened to fund that recovery ( and of entire western Europe ) via Marshall Plan. Who, exactly will fund US recovery? I am not sure if you noticed, but central banks have been looking around for an alternative to USD[1] so further debt binge may not be an actual option soon.

This brings me to the original point. Drastic measures will eventually need to be taken. If those are taken now, they will be much less painful.

I am not sure this adds much to the conversation. I will ignore it for unless you think it is relevant. If so, please elaborate.

[1]https://www.cnbc.com/2022/03/22/countries-may-want-to-divers...

Re: Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

#616

Post by alldayeveryday »

A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #615
alldayeveryday wrote: post #613

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> … is shared sacrifice similar to how a war effort is sold. You actually posed a solution here not a disproof. Yes all this requires selling changes to the public and under a social message. One doesn’t need math to know this, it is intuitively true. > from where to where I already answered this. > re-allocation is not going to happen because even the current allocation was a result of heavy compromise. So anything…

I am convinced, just about anything can be done given enough effort, time and money. That said, how much of those would have to be expended to undo current compromise status quo? I personally would venture a lot more than most people would be willing to give in exchange. Um.. yes, because US just happened to fund that recovery ( and of entire western Europe ) via Marshall Plan. Who, exactly will fund US recovery? I a…

Eh, the US didn’t fund the German recovery. I think you seem to be confusing pre WW2 Germany (30s) and post war Germany (50s). The German state before national socialism was having hyper inflation, spiraling unemployment and a failing economy. The national socialists created one of the greatest economic recoveries of all time. It took the entire western world plus Russia to conquer it.

Post war Germany was hallowed out and the nation is a husk of what it once was, basically a US vassal state.

Re: Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

#617

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

alldayeveryday wrote: post #616
A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #615

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am convinced, just about anything can be done given enough effort, time and money. That said, how much of those would have to be expended to undo current compromise status quo? I personally would venture a lot more than most people would be willing to give in exchange. Um.. yes, because US just happened to fund that recovery ( and of entire western Europe ) via Marshall Plan. Who, exactly will fund US recovery? I a…

Eh, the US didn’t fund the German recovery. I think you seem to be confusing pre WW2 Germany (30s) and post war Germany (50s). The German state before national socialism was having hyper inflation, spiraling unemployment and a failing economy. The national socialists created one of the greatest economic recoveries of all time. It took the entire western world plus Russia to conquer it. Post war Germany was hallowed o…

Then, sadly, you are even more wrong than before when I gave you the benefit of the doubt. 30s Germany got their stuff under control for reasons that are kinda frowned upon these days ( actual fascism - as in convergence of state control and private sector, waging war and annexing parts of Europe for lebensraum, removing from society perceived outsiders, dissidents and other undesirables and so on ). I would like to think you are not suggesting those solutions implemented.

If you would like to rebut, please give me the 'good policies', 30s Germany implemented. I worry that may you have the 'national socialism' part confused at best.

Somewhat accurate. How would explain the Nordstream debacle then?

edit: I decided to pre-empt it a little. I am not interested in discussing whether fascism was left or right wing ideology. I had this argument before it gets ridiculous fast. I am going to bow out should it happen here.

Re: Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

#618

Post by alldayeveryday »

A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #617
alldayeveryday wrote: post #616

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Eh, the US didn’t fund the German recovery. I think you seem to be confusing pre WW2 Germany (30s) and post war Germany (50s). The German state before national socialism was having hyper inflation, spiraling unemployment and a failing economy. The national socialists created one of the greatest economic recoveries of all time. It took the entire western world plus Russia to conquer it. Post war Germany was hallowed o…

Then, sadly, you are even more wrong than before when I gave you the benefit of the doubt. 30s Germany got their stuff under control for reasons that are kinda frowned upon these days ( actual fascism - as in convergence of state control and private sector, waging war and annexing parts of Europe for lebensraum, removing from society perceived outsiders, dissidents and other undesirables and so on ). I would like to…

> I would like to think you are not suggesting those solutions implemented.

Why not? Cause the current ruling class frowns up it?

> I am going to bow out should it happen here.

Then the system propaganda has worked fully. You police your own speech.

Re: Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

#619

Post by A4ET8a8uTh0 »

alldayeveryday wrote: post #618
A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #617

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Then, sadly, you are even more wrong than before when I gave you the benefit of the doubt. 30s Germany got their stuff under control for reasons that are kinda frowned upon these days ( actual fascism - as in convergence of state control and private sector, waging war and annexing parts of Europe for lebensraum, removing from society perceived outsiders, dissidents and other undesirables and so on ). I would like to…

> I would like to think you are not suggesting those solutions implemented. Why not? Cause the current ruling class frowns up it? > I am going to bow out should it happen here. Then the system propaganda has worked fully. You police your own speech.

I will expand a little on the why so as not to look like I am being difficult. I am actively avoiding the conversation I mentioned not because of propaganda, fear thereof, its impact or even because I police my own speech. I avoid it because it is largely pointless. For better or worse, both major parties in US noted that you can make anything work well if you compare the other team to nazis. For that reason and that reason alone, you will see constant bickering whether fascism is a left or right wing ideology, which manages to completely miss the point, because it does not rely on two poles of US politics ( that likes to keep things simple for people ) for its origin. It is like trying to put a square in a round box. It can be done, but nuance will be lost.

No. Because it is a bad idea. It is difficult to put in words how bad an idea it is, but I will say this. For all my beef with current system, at least it has a degree of predictability and stability to it, which is more than most periods that came before it. It is pretty selfish, but I would like that state to continue for as long as possible. Proposed solutions will not make for a stable society.

edit: removed opening paragraph. not necessary

Re: Gitlab to lay off 7% of staff

#620

Post by alldayeveryday »

A4ET8a8uTh0 wrote: post #619
alldayeveryday wrote: post #618

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I would like to think you are not suggesting those solutions implemented. Why not? Cause the current ruling class frowns up it? > I am going to bow out should it happen here. Then the system propaganda has worked fully. You police your own speech.

I will expand a little on the why so as not to look like I am being difficult. I am actively avoiding the conversation I mentioned not because of propaganda, fear thereof, its impact or even because I police my own speech. I avoid it because it is largely pointless. For better or worse, both major parties in US noted that you can make anything work well if you compare the other team to nazis. For that reason and that…

> For better or worse, both major parties in US noted that you can make anything work well if you compare the other team to nazis.

Agreed, I think this serves a common purpose as other generalized propaganda on the subject. The idea is to poison the well concerning any good-faith discussion of national socialism such that people self-moderate and dismiss the idea prima facie. In this very thread, I pointed to the economic recovery in pre-WW2 Germany which was undeniably facilitated by a shift to nationalist, socialist policies. When I did, you dismissed the idea immediately due to "facism" - announcing you'd withdraw from the conversation if indeed national socialism was the topic.

> No. Because it is a bad idea. It is difficult to put in words how bad an idea it is.

Precisely, I've seen this pattern time and time again. It is prima facie a bad idea, but proof cannot be articulated. In such cases, the fallback is often (not accusing you of this) to attack the person suggesting the idea rather than the idea itself (ad hominem). I agree predictability and stability are ideal characteristics, but only in scenarios where there are other positive characteristics. Predictable and stable misery is a pretty bad state to be in. I think we can agree that the current system has many faults. One of these faults, I think, is that the system has optimized the wealth and opportunity for a very few in number. I believe the nation requires a shift in philosophy away from globalist, hyper individualism, and towards an inward looking (nationalist) stance that optimizes the wellbeing of the people (socialism). Such a shift in national philosophy, as was seen in pre-WW2 Germany, has shown an ability to correct for the excesses and decay of a globalist and individual culture, improving the outlook dramatically for the citizens. By many measures (num of children, unemployment, inflation, wealth, life expectancy) national socialism improved Germany dramatically.

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