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Extreme Minimalism: this guy owns just 15 things

andrewhy.de

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Re: Extreme Minimalism: this guy owns just 15 things

#151

Post by hendler »

andrewhyde wrote: post #120
jdietrich wrote: post #80

This isn't minimalism in any sense of the word, it's just a consumerist vanity. OP's 'minimalism' is sustained by a reliance upon huge amounts of infrastructure, most of it environmentally unsustainable. He doesn't carry stuff with him, but uses money to access what he needs. It's like claiming to be a minimalist because you own a second house where you keep all your stuff. OP outsources the burden of sustaining his…

OP here. I don't see your point but feel all your anger. Not sure if I'm just catching it from another project, but it is odd to me that you default from a guy owning a few shirts to causing major economic injustices. I don't own much physically. I spend my days volunteering and traveling living a pretty simple life. I write posts and sometimes people like and share them. This post was written in May of last year and…

I think the original post is good feedback for you.

Your angle might be that you can save time and be happier by owning fewer things? That's good advice. As an innovator, you've offered advice that can help other innovators with our first-world problems finding happiness.

There's some anger in the response, yes. But you are being made an example of. There's still a life of privilege in the way you're living, that probably you'd be happy to acknowledge. There's also some things that might not care about that others do - like carbon footprint, modern consumerism, money inequities, vegetarianism, etc. Or maybe you do care about those things too.

Re: Extreme Minimalism: this guy owns just 15 things

#152

Post by jdietrich »

andrewhyde wrote: post #120
jdietrich wrote: post #80

This isn't minimalism in any sense of the word, it's just a consumerist vanity. OP's 'minimalism' is sustained by a reliance upon huge amounts of infrastructure, most of it environmentally unsustainable. He doesn't carry stuff with him, but uses money to access what he needs. It's like claiming to be a minimalist because you own a second house where you keep all your stuff. OP outsources the burden of sustaining his…

OP here. I don't see your point but feel all your anger. Not sure if I'm just catching it from another project, but it is odd to me that you default from a guy owning a few shirts to causing major economic injustices. I don't own much physically. I spend my days volunteering and traveling living a pretty simple life. I write posts and sometimes people like and share them. This post was written in May of last year and…

> I don't own much physically. I spend my days volunteering and traveling living a pretty simple life.

That's the nub - you don't live a simple life, you live a very complicated life where the "stuff" in your life has been abstracted out of sight.

To define ownership by physical possession is utterly facile. The economic decisions you make result in great mountains of "stuff" being made and used and consumed. You haven't structured your life to have less "stuff" in it, only that you avoid having to carry it.

Aviation fuel is stuff. It has mass and volume, it smells and tastes of something. Huge facilities have been built to extract and refine it, and vast areas of land and sea have been irrevocably damaged by that process. Very real, physical wars were fought over it. Your plane ticket is a stake in all of that, a fractional ownership of the machinery that puts a plane in the air.

Viewed from inside your head, your life seems minimal. But from a bird's eye, it looks like a bulldozer on the rampage.

This community is one of hackers, people who strive to look more deeply, to understand how things work at the most fundamental level. If we do not understand the deep impact of the things we consume and the lives we lead, who else?

Re: Extreme Minimalism: this guy owns just 15 things

#153

Post by blahedo »

qntm wrote: post #147
bmj wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think you're reading this as "I am trying to do away with material things and spend less money." But, really, I think this example is "I live out of my backpack because I have money in the bank and it affords me great flexibility in my lifestyle."

> I am trying to do away with material things and spend less money. Point being, these two things are orthogonal to one another.

And yet, both can be legitimately called (a form of) "minimalism". Just depends what you're minimising.

Re: Extreme Minimalism: this guy owns just 15 things

#154

Post by silentscope »

andrewhyde wrote: post #112
drumdance wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

(Disclosure: I know Andrew) "Real minimalists?" What, is there like a club or something? Unlike you, Andrew isn't engaging in a game of "shoulds" and "oughts." He's just experimenting with his lifestyle and learning from the process.

(Disclosure: I am Andrew) This is a project to help with some personal growth, not really a "I'm better" or "everyone should be like me." It is just something I did. It taught me amazing things.

My brother, currently running a non-profit abroad, utilizes a similar lifestyle. Everything he owns he can fit into his small backpack.

I learned a ton from him about the benefits of mobility--something I would have thought the lean, mobile startup crowd here on HN would've related to more.

Attachments--to belongings or business plans are a source of strength but are also over emphasized. I admire what you've done and think we could use a lot more of it.

Cheers!

Re: Extreme Minimalism: this guy owns just 15 things

#155

Post by TomAnthony »

anamax wrote: post #114
TomAnthony wrote: post #40

There are a bunch of comments that this guy actually owns more than 15 things, and that others cope with less, and he isn't in the 3rd world etc. All true; his system isn't as extreme as the headline would have you believe. However, I see the takeaway is that he gets by with a lot less stuff than the average person in his demographic, and I think that is something to be applauded. I know I wouldn't relish doing it li…

> However, I see the takeaway is that he gets by with a lot less stuff than the average person in his demographic Except that he doesn't. He merely doesn't own the stuff that he uses/consumes.

Sure, for some of the things that may be true. However, he doesn't have a basement full of junk, kitchen cupboards full of slowly perishing food, or a car etc.; things that most people do and could do fine without. Whether or not this all balances out as an overall plus, I cannot fathom.

As I said - he isn't doing it perfectly, but he is doing some of it better. The main problem seems to be it is being oversold by him/the media.

Re: Extreme Minimalism: this guy owns just 15 things

#157

Post by notahacker »

mechanical_fish wrote: post #122
jdietrich wrote: post #80

This isn't minimalism in any sense of the word, it's just a consumerist vanity. OP's 'minimalism' is sustained by a reliance upon huge amounts of infrastructure, most of it environmentally unsustainable. He doesn't carry stuff with him, but uses money to access what he needs. It's like claiming to be a minimalist because you own a second house where you keep all your stuff. OP outsources the burden of sustaining his…

Minimalism , like most words describing styles, is a very flexible word. If I write a composition in which a single person plays a pair of water glasses with one drumstick, that's "minimalism". And if I employ a very expensive sound studio to record a famous pop song consisting of the simplest possible drum track, a sparse guitar riff, a one-note vocal part with occasional distortion, and a toy Casio organ, that's al…

I think the cumulative value of all the resources ever paid for by many subsistence farmers or others considered "poor" on a world scale probably wouldn't add up to the cost of the MacBook Pro in Andrew's laptop. I believe his demands on infrastructure may be a little more too. So are mine.

Of course Andrew's claim to minimalism is only relative to most people in the developed world. But there are tens of thousands of twentysomethings from developed countries travelling the world for extended periods of time with a similar amount of luggage (Most of us spend a bit more on clothes and a bit less on laptops; guess it depends on whether you prefer the inconvenience of laundry or Windows!) It seems to be as mandatory as national service for youthful Australians (and a mandatory experience after national service for Israelis). The secret about life on the road being fun got out a while ago.

It's not Andrew's fault, of course, if news coverage tries to turn him into some sort of innovator he's perhaps never claimed to be.

Re: Extreme Minimalism: this guy owns just 15 things

#158

Post by angrycoder »

jdietrich wrote: post #80

This isn't minimalism in any sense of the word, it's just a consumerist vanity. OP's 'minimalism' is sustained by a reliance upon huge amounts of infrastructure, most of it environmentally unsustainable. He doesn't carry stuff with him, but uses money to access what he needs. It's like claiming to be a minimalist because you own a second house where you keep all your stuff. OP outsources the burden of sustaining his…

You make the guy sound like Pol Pot rather than a dude who just lives out of a suit case.

Your post is at least keeping with the theme that has been prevalent over the past few days, HN is just mean now.

Re: Extreme Minimalism: this guy owns just 15 things

#159

Post by endlessvoid94 »

keiferski wrote: post #71

Having been a "minimalism-addict", I've come to the conclusion that the best part is the act of getting rid of things , not the act of having few things . Getting rid of junk is liberating; living with 15 things is just a pain in the ass.

Agreed 1000% percent. It's the journey, not the destination.

Re: Extreme Minimalism: this guy owns just 15 things

#160

Post by ctdonath »

Retric wrote: post #74
readme wrote: post #67

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Starbucks does add up, but I would say that it is minimalism (Especially if you are using it as an office) From an individual's perspective, it is not minimalist, because now you will need to have an entire coffee shop in your life to obtain coffee. However, from a societal viewpoint, it is very minimalist, because now each person can share the means to produce coffee, thus consuming less: electricity, water (assumin…

I think just printing a receipt for each cup makes the whole process less efficient for society. Let alone disposable cups etc.

Starbucks doesn't print a receipt unless you want one, and you are welcome to bring & fill your own mug there. You can even use your smartphone to pay.
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