Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

efinancialcareers.com

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

431–440 of 595 posts

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#431

Post by gniv »

InfamousRece wrote: post #98
klaussilveira wrote: post #19

Heh. I'm pretty proficient in modern C++, and it is my favorite tool for a lot of things, but my PHP job pays way more than any C++ position available. Did an interview once for Senior C++ Engineer, embedded software in the medical device space. All went good, until the offer: $100k. Articles like this are nothing more than a desperate attempt at getting younger generations to learn said topic, so companies can pay t…

I had an offer from robotics company: 80k and no benefits. I’m not sure where to find good paying C++ jobs outside of finance.

> I’m not sure where to find good paying C++ jobs outside of finance.

Most of FAANG backend infrastructure is written in C++. Lots of open positions as senior folks retire early from there.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#432

Post by jack_pp »

jedberg wrote: post #364
Xenoamorphous wrote: post #360

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most of the jobs I can think have fixed working hours/shifts?

Not most software engineering jobs. And it wasn't the fixed eight hours, it was the eight hours on top of that each day that was the problem.

how do you know for certain you'd be required to do overtime consistently? you've never worked in the field. I haven't either but I'm not assuming crazy stuff like being required to work 16h a day. your stance is completely unreasonable. There are other commenters who have worked in the field and said no one was expected to be in the office after normal working hours

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#433

Post by lordnacho »

mr_00ff00 wrote: post #412
tw1984 wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

for stuff like gaming & HFT, you are probably forced to do it in C++, it is a sad reality affecting small % of developers. for everything else, if you are still building fresh new projects in C++, you are making a big mistake. C++ today is like Cobol in 2010. yes, there are reasons for them to exist, people tell your the good old days, probably some fresh good recent experience. but come on, there is a much better pl…

Why is gaming and HFT forced to be C++? Just that code already exists in C++ and you need to expand on it? Gaming has Unreal but surely you could use another game engine without C++?

Simply put cpp gives you ultimate control. If you want to be absolutely economical with the CPU/memory, you need to do things likely preallocate memory and making sure you don't get cache misses and branch mispredicts.

For most software, the hardware has already run away to the point where you can just sort of tell the machine roughly what to do and it will do it for you in a way that doesn't affect your task, so you don't have to fiddle with minutiae like where exactly to place a thing in memory.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#434

Post by sirsinsalot »

stagger87 wrote: post #250
jedberg wrote: post #142

There are plenty of talented C++ programmers. They just don't want to be abused by trading firms or work in that culture. Even paying them more won't work, because no amount of money is worth that abuse. I interviewed at a trading firm once, while I was working at Netflix (because Netflix encouraged us to interview for outside jobs at least once a year). The comp would have been double my Netflix salary. But I would…

Just to clarify, you used the word "abuse" several times to describe a job where you would have to work in office between 8:30 to 5 and pull (I'm safely assuming) half a million dollars a year?

I can clarify: software devs can be divas just like any other highly paid and pedestaled job

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#435

Post by bombolo »

kevin_thibedeau wrote: post #351
jedberg wrote: post #286

Earlier quoted context omitted.

8:30 to 5 was required, but also never working at home was required, so what I was trying to (poorly) say is that they basically expected you to live in the office and never see your family. I'll update accordingly. And the comp package I turned down was about $700k at the time, which was 10 years ago. Nowadays it would be a $1M+ job easy. But not seeing my family is not worth any amount of money to me, since there a…

That's not abusive. That's a rational security posture. Defense contractor employees can't take their work home either. It's nice when you can't be pressured to work off hours.

Hello!

I work on a software used (not exclusively) by the USA armed forces.

I work from home for the most part. I can do that while travelling as well but I have some limitations on which countries I can do that from. But I'm not sure of the entire list.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#436

Post by b4je7d7wb »

userbinator wrote: post #404
jedberg wrote: post #363

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not an eight hour job, you're completely misreading it. It's eight hours required plus another eight each day of overtime. Which is abusive for a software engineer. And those people that work months away from their families -- they're being abused too. You'll notice that the owners of oil rigs aren't out there with them, for example.

you're completely misreading it Re-read your original description again. Nowhere did you say you had to work 16h a day.

It is implied by not allowing to work from home. There wouldn't be a need to work from home if it was a 9-5 job.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#437

Post by delta_p_delta_x »

fxtentacle wrote: post #426
jedberg wrote: post #142

There are plenty of talented C++ programmers. They just don't want to be abused by trading firms or work in that culture. Even paying them more won't work, because no amount of money is worth that abuse. I interviewed at a trading firm once, while I was working at Netflix (because Netflix encouraged us to interview for outside jobs at least once a year). The comp would have been double my Netflix salary. But I would…

Fully agree. I've also seen my fair share of very restrictive no-remote work offers, but they didn't even offer exceptional pay in exchange. And those C++ automotive jobs in Germany? Sorry, I'm not even going to interview for 70k€ annually.

> And those C++ automotive jobs in Germany? Sorry, I'm not even going to interview for 70k€ annually.

I'd take that job in a heartbeat. Working on cars? Check. Nice European country? Check. Work-life balance? Double-check. What's not to like?

Maybe it's because I'm looking for fresh graduate jobs, and 70000€ looks very attractive to me, even with a 35% tax.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#438

Post by trinovantes »

lelanthran wrote: post #408
TillE wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Speaking as a professional C++ developer for the past 20 years, I think this sums it up well. A modern project should be able to use most of C++17 at least. Even if you still need to target some ancient garbage like Windows XP, you can use an MSVC toolchain that supports C++17. That's a good basis to work from. So your real concern is the moldy old code that's written for C++03, that's still not using std::unique_ptr…

> If you're given license to finally rewrite that [C++03] code to modern standards Then you aren't choosing C++20-something, you're choosing a new language altogether. This is why the demand for C++ devs is dropping - if you're going to bite the bullet and rewrite, why not choose a better language, preferably with GC?

They probably want the performance of C++ without the learning curve of Rust

It's not like C++20 is completely different. There's just a lot more utilities in the stdlib so hopefully less raw pointer magic.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#439

Post by manuel_w »

coliveira wrote: post #178
bitL wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not just embedded, robotics or automotive have pretty low C++ salaries while much higher for Java or even JavaScript... C++ devs are punished for being more capable.

It's not an issue of capacity, it is demand. C++ developers cannot write websites in C++, so big companies will have to pay somebody else.

Not posting to make a counterpoint but simply because related and interesting for the C++ folks around here.

> Wt is a web GUI library in modern C++. Quickly develop highly interactive web UIs with widgets, without having to write a single line of JavaScript. Wt handles all request handling and page rendering for you, so you can focus on functionality.

https://www.webtoolkit.eu/wt

HN submission: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=23812791

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#440

Post by tjpnz »

jedberg wrote: post #375
closeparen wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>if you weren't a top performer, you were let go If "top performer" is defined as, say, 90th percentile, does that imply >90% turnover?

No, not at all. You didn't have to be a top performer at Netflix , you had to be a top performer industrywide. Netflix basically tried to keep only people who would be rated as top performers at other companies. Think of it like a sports team (which is how Netflix always described it). They wanted the best people in the league.

Didn't it make you feel as though there was a target on your back constantly? What happens if something in your personal life results in you having a bad quarter?
Post reply on HN