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US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

torrentfreak.com

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Re: US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

#71

Post by droithomme »

lachyg wrote: post #70
droithomme wrote: post #68

The sooner she starts her term the sooner she gets out, so this is good for her. The obvious problem here is sending copyright violators to federal prison for long terms, costing taxpayers hundreds of thousands of dollars. Killers and drug dealers often get shorter sentences, and bankers that steal billions don't go to prison at all. To say this is justice is a stretch. Running a video site that hosts unlicensed cont…

What punishment, if any, do you believe is fair for her?

Depends on what she actually did. Isn't copyright violation a civil and not criminal matter? How is what she did different from youtube? You know, even today there are hundreds of thousands of hours of unlicensed movie and show content on youtube. Why aren't they being investigated.

Really the only difference I see is she is black and doesn't have friends in high places. If she sold the site to Google she'd be on the cover of Forbes rather than in jail.

Re: US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

#72

Post by tzs »

tomp wrote: post #51
lachyg wrote: post #6

My comment doesn't directly relate to the issue in the article (how she's being put in jail early) but I'll go ahead anyway. Does anyone honestly think piracy should go unpunished? People that upload movies, music, games etc should be punished, as they are doing something illegal and and the people downloading should also be punished as they are getting the content without paying the creators. I'm curious if anyone h…

Your assumptions are wrong. When people pirate content (download without paying), that doesn't necessarily mean that they are not paying the content creators. A Swiss government study found out that people's entertainment budgets are relatively constant - what we don't spend for digital content, we spend for concerts and such. So, there is no real economic harm from piracy (if there was, Hollywood wouldn't be having…

> A Swiss government study found out that people's entertainment budgets are relatively constant - what we don't spend for digital content, we spend for concerts and such. So, there is no real economic harm from piracy

Your second sentence does not follow at all from the first. When people have a fixed budget, piracy might not change how much they spend, but it will change the distribution of the spending.

For instance, if someone could not pirate, they might buy two albums a month and see one movie in a theater. If they pirate, they can pirate the music, and go out to the movies twice. Same total spent, but the musicians have been harmed, and the movie producers have benefited.

Re: US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

#73

Post by lachyg »

droithomme wrote: post #71
lachyg wrote: post #70

Earlier quoted context omitted.

What punishment, if any, do you believe is fair for her?

Depends on what she actually did. Isn't copyright violation a civil and not criminal matter? How is what she did different from youtube? You know, even today there are hundreds of thousands of hours of unlicensed movie and show content on youtube. Why aren't they being investigated. Really the only difference I see is she is black and doesn't have friends in high places. If she sold the site to Google she'd be on the…

What she was doing was definitely not what YouTube does / did! YouTube is a video sharing website, where the intent is to share video in which you own the copyright to, obviously with such a large community you will have people that will break the rules.

NinjaVideo is a site that's #1 purpose is to upload copyrighted tv shows and movies, hours after their airing. Its defined purpose is piracy.

Clear difference from YouTube here.

As to your "Why aren't they being investigated." comment -- they are, YouTube is quite proactive in automatic removals, DMCA's, detection of copyrighted music, etc.

Re: US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

#74

Post by 18pfsmt »

lachyg wrote: post #60
realo wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Picture this for a moment: It's your Birthday. Your friends invited you to the nicest restaurant in town. Very nice venue, food is great. End of meal... time for dessert. Your friends love you and, together, singe you the nicest rendition of 'Happy Birthday To You' you ever heard. Life is good. This was an illegal performance. Secret police comes in, puts your friends in prison (they stole & performed the song) and a…

It's taken me three hours to really think about your comment, and I can't really think of a satisfying response. Your hyperbole aside, I think this is apples and oranges. I don't think it's a comparable situation. People playing Nirvana in a garage and singing Happy Birthday to You at birthday parties is not the same thing as downloading material that you have access to buy. It's accepted that we can partake in these…

I'm glad you brought up the point about people profiting from copyrighted works for which they do not have the rights because in the US, that is the only thing that is criminally offensive wrt piracy. Downloading content without payment simply for personal consumption, however, is a civil matter between the copyright holder and the downloader.

The current legislation under consideration surrounding copyrights attempts to shift the burden of enforcement from the private, copyright-holding entities to the public, or another private company that is only tangentially related (i.e. advertising platforms).

Re: US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

#75

Post by droithomme »

fourspace wrote: post #49
lachyg wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh god no, definitely not. Monetary damages, yes. Prison sentences for a non-violent crime, definitely not.

Just to play devil's advocate here, what you're saying is that folks like Bernie Madoff should not go to prison.

Lots of old folks lost their pensions because of Madoff. People lost their homes. People lost their health insurance. People have died because of what he, and most everyone else on wall street has been up to. So yes theirs was a violent crime. Not that they will ever be punished. We know now that they own the government, bought with the money the stole.

As far as this woman, she ran a video site that had user uploaded content that was streamed to other users. Same business model as youtube and google videos, and youtube has more unlicensed content than ninja video ever did yet isn't being investigated at all.

Re: US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

#76

Post by lachyg »

tomjen3 wrote: post #57
lachyg wrote: post #6

My comment doesn't directly relate to the issue in the article (how she's being put in jail early) but I'll go ahead anyway. Does anyone honestly think piracy should go unpunished? People that upload movies, music, games etc should be punished, as they are doing something illegal and and the people downloading should also be punished as they are getting the content without paying the creators. I'm curious if anyone h…

You were correctly downvoted for you posted a stupid question -- just because it is illegal doesn't make it wrong. And only wrong things should be punished.

I would love to hear your explanation on why piracy is not wrong! That was the exact purpose of the question, so others would share their views on the matter and I would have an enlightened view.

Re: US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

#77

Post by tzs »

nicki_easy wrote: post #20
tzs wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Did you read the article, or are you just commenting based on the misleading headline?

I did, yes. Also this one: http://prospect.org/article/ninja-our-sites And this one: http://torrentfreak.com/ninjavideo-founder-sentenced-to-22-m... And this one: http://www.app.com/article/20120113/NJNEWS10/301130030/-Quee... And here are the sentencing memo, the government's motion for reconsideration of self-surrender, and the response to the government's motion for reconsideration of self-surrender: http://www.sc…

Then why did you say "RIP free speech"? Convicts generally either lose most of their rights, or have them severely restricted.

She is a convict. The only reason she was not in jail (where she would have had no access to Facebook or Twitter or other social media) was because they had a shortage of space so were letting her stay out until space opened up.

There is no free speech issue here.

Re: US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

#78

Post by dchest »

lachyg wrote: post #69
dchest wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was replying to the comment that "doesn't directly relate to the issue in the article" http://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=3464128

I think the onus lies on the distributor (Amazon, Hulu, NinjaViedo) more so than the consumer. I do believe the consumer holds a relative degree of responsibility (and I guess this is what should be determined by a court) - e.g. it's obvious with Ninja, but some sites might not be so obvious e.g. if, like Amazon, Netflix distributed a movie that they did not have rights to -- then it falls on them.

OK, if the court can determine whether a consumer has a degree of responsibility, surely a consumer can determine if she's participating in a "copyright infringement"? If you search the Web for "watch big buck bunny online free" and download/watch one of the found files, can you tell when you infringe copyright and when not?

Re: US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

#79

Post by 18pfsmt »

dangrossman wrote: post #58
toyg wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'll bite: do you honestly think people should be sent to prison for copyright offences? Monetary damages, yes; bankruptcy, maybe (if the infringement was on mass-scale and resulted in direct profit for the guilty, say, above 1000$); but prison ? Prison is not about punishment, in a civil society; it's about isolating individuals with the potential to irreparably harm their community. Unless the copyright holders go…

@oelewapperke : You are hellbanned so (almost) nobody can see your comments. Copyright infringement is also a criminal offense punishable by imprisonment and statutory damages. See http://www.copyright.gov/title17/92chap5.html#506

Just to be clear, commercial copyright infringement (i.e. for profit) is criminal, personal copyright infringement (i.e. you download it and watch it) is civil.

Re: US Authorities Silence NinjaVideo Founder, Rush Her to Prison

#80

Post by schiffern »

fourspace wrote: post #49
lachyg wrote: post #38

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Oh god no, definitely not. Monetary damages, yes. Prison sentences for a non-violent crime, definitely not.

Just to play devil's advocate here, what you're saying is that folks like Bernie Madoff should not go to prison.

If the monetary compensation actually proportional (i.e. not just a slap on the wrist), then I would be completely satisfied.
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