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The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

efinancialcareers.com

61–70 of 595 posts

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#61
This is the capitalist version of Vonnegut's "everybody wants to build and nobody wants to do maintenance." The kind of programming HFT firms want to do has vanishingly low diminishing returns basically everywhere else. They're used to lazily offering high pay and bad working conditions to self-driven people who learned C++ because it was the only tool available. Now other languages are mature and they are being caught flat-footed without a development pipeline for junior devs.

Strategically I understand - it was a pretty good bet that you could use the same "get gud" philosophy that still powers their trading desks, but they just got unlucky because we're in a moment where the net opportunity-cost for not-learning c++ is basically a reward (better work experience, often better money).

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#62
Headline makes me think of RPG (the language, look it up [0]). It's basically disappeared, but it was one of the key languages used to develop much of the banking system waaaaay back. For a variety of reasons, it's still very much present but the experts are in their 70s and anyone competent enough to debug is well into their late 50s at the youngest.

Attempts at upgrading to, say C++ or Java usually fail for the same reason any massive system-defining upgrade fails, so they have to trot these guys out every now and then to the tune of $100-500K per day whenever there's a problem.

Moral of the story - sometimes it could be a better very long-term strategy to be an expert at just one language that has enough mission-critical functions in an industry that doesn't like investing in IT. C++ could turn into one.

[0] https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/IBM_RPG

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

These are financial firms griping about the lack of developers. They're some of the highest paid developers in the world. But working for these companies is also insanely stressful. Long hours, high pressure. Maybe that reputation has caught up to them.

Exactly. They pay well, but the job is absolutely stressful. If you survive long enough to enjoy some of this money, good luck for you, you deserve.

The best thing they could do to attract talent would be to offer a choice of 3, 4 or 5 days for 60%, 80% or 100% salary. Many people would probably choose 3 days at a high paying finance job over 5 days somewhere else and 60% of the money they tend to offer at those companies would still be really good money.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#65

> Where are all the C++ programmers? People are seemingly scared away from the language by a terrible stigma: the notion that it is a legacy program. I think this is because the pool of jobs for C++ programmers is so small. I took a position as a web dev at a company whose main product was a CAD application. Most of my work was in NodeJS, but occasionally, I'd have to dip into the C/C++ layer to make some API changes…

There's this mindset that you have to avoid finding a niche, because you're limiting your options.

Being a perfect fullstack devops generalist is like fishing in the ocean with trillions of fish, while having a niche is more like just shooting fish in a barrel.

You don't need an unlimited supply of jobs. You just need one job, and specializing in something puts you in a good position to find one.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#68

Writing new C++ code with all the modern approaches and tooling doesn't sound so bad. Troubleshooting a big legacy C++ codebase is probably something that Dante would have included in his Inferno as a punishment for pride and hubris.

> Troubleshooting a big legacy C++ codebase

... with deadlines measured in hours.

Re: The pool of talented C++ developers is running dry

#69

> Where are all the C++ programmers? People are seemingly scared away from the language by a terrible stigma: the notion that it is a legacy program. I think this is because the pool of jobs for C++ programmers is so small. I took a position as a web dev at a company whose main product was a CAD application. Most of my work was in NodeJS, but occasionally, I'd have to dip into the C/C++ layer to make some API changes…

C++ is here for longer than your career will last. Outside of HN/Web bubbles it's still used everywhere. Chances are you're writing this message on a C/C++ OS running a C/C++ browser engine. NodeJS and v8 are C++ applications.

I went to a lecture by Stroustrup once who was asked what he thought of Java and jokingly said he didn't like to be negative about C++ applications. While this is a joke and Java isn't actually written in C++ (anymore?), it's good to remember the majority of the stack under yours is probably in it.

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