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Firefighters forced to smash window of driverless Cruise taxi to stop it

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Re: Firefighters forced to smash window of driverless Cruise taxi to stop it

#21

So what is the solution? Let emergency services have a remote control STOP button? But it would have many implications for passengers too

This is not a serious solution but it would probably work: place a fake traffic light in the road in front of the hose.

Re: Firefighters forced to smash window of driverless Cruise taxi to stop it

#23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Carjackings and other crimes where people could press the button in a bad part of town and pull the riders out.

Or just jump in front of the car which is supposed to stop and then your companions handle carjacking the immobilized vehicle. There are many ways to normally stop or trick an autonomous vehicle without needing a big red button to stop it. Spike strips are used by police to stop human driven vehicles all the time.

What about if someone triggers it when you're traveling 75 mph on the highway?

Re: Firefighters forced to smash window of driverless Cruise taxi to stop it

#24
Obviously autonomous vehicles need to be able to respond to officials directing traffic for any reason -- making way for ambulances, stopping for firefighters, being pulled over for a faulty headlight.

Surely Cruise and Waymo have thought about this. Curious how it's supposed to work normally, and whether something about it failed in this case?

How is an official supposed to get a moving autonomous vehicle to stop or obey non-standard directions (back up to make room for a fire truck)? Is it supposed to require any special training on the part of officials, or are remote operators supposed to always be watching for it? And what happens if the regular communications channel to remote operators fails?

Re: Firefighters forced to smash window of driverless Cruise taxi to stop it

#25

So what is the solution? Let emergency services have a remote control STOP button? But it would have many implications for passengers too

Escalators have big red “Emergency Stop” buttons anyone can press when things go wrong. Why not one for autonomous vehicles, too?

Passenger safety concerns? If anyone would be able to stop an autonomous vehicle, it may be not always in the passenger's best interest. Could be OK if the passenger has an override, though - if they decide to tell the car to not comply with a legitimate stop request, it should be treated as if they'd be driving themselves and refused to stop.

And, obviously, emergency stop should initiate stopping, but the vehicle should do so only when it's safe. It's not an escalator that's safe to halt immediately and at any moment.

For an completely unmanned vehicle (driving to pick up or to recharge/park for the night) - probably no big deal.

Re: Firefighters forced to smash window of driverless Cruise taxi to stop it

#26

So what is the solution? Let emergency services have a remote control STOP button? But it would have many implications for passengers too

The solution is to have a person inside the car controlling it. A revolutionary idea indeed.

Re: Firefighters forced to smash window of driverless Cruise taxi to stop it

#27
post #8
post #5

Aren't they supposed to respond to gestures? What do they do if someone is directing traffic? And I guess the question if they do respond to traffic directing gestures: how do they avoid obvious pranks from drunk people?

Throw on a reflective vest & you'll have no problem pranking human drivers with your traffic signals

A surprising number of humans have no problem with doing things to faceless computers and public or corporate infrastructure that they would never do to another human being with whom they were making eye contact.

Few are willing to don the reflective vest and ruin someone's day by lying to their face and directing them down a bad detour, but I have no problem believing that a lot of people would laugh at a stupid self-driving car wasting its time and energy following their hand signals.

Re: Firefighters forced to smash window of driverless Cruise taxi to stop it

#28
post #15

So what is the solution? Let emergency services have a remote control STOP button? But it would have many implications for passengers too

The solution is recognizing that we are nowhere near ready for driverless cars. With "ordinary" software, you can look at all of the use cases and if you solve 5% of them in a really good way, you can be successful, users will self-select whether those 5% of the use cases are valuable for them, and then not use your software for anything else. With driverless self-driving vehicles, you have no such comfort. Even if y…

I really believe that with that attitude, we'll never be "ready" for driverless cars.

> We are not curing cancer or feeding the world here, we are trying to make people get rich by eliminating the cost of labour for a human driver. No way this calculus should prioritize investors over human lives in any sane society.

How about, we're trying to make transportation cheaper for everyone by eliminating the most expensive part of taxi cabs (human labor)? Transportation being cheaper means people can get better jobs further away from where they live, see family more often, etc.

Before you mention public transportation, realize that it would benefit from driverless technologies as well (aka, not zero sum).

Re: Firefighters forced to smash window of driverless Cruise taxi to stop it

#30
post #15

So what is the solution? Let emergency services have a remote control STOP button? But it would have many implications for passengers too

The solution is recognizing that we are nowhere near ready for driverless cars. With "ordinary" software, you can look at all of the use cases and if you solve 5% of them in a really good way, you can be successful, users will self-select whether those 5% of the use cases are valuable for them, and then not use your software for anything else. With driverless self-driving vehicles, you have no such comfort. Even if y…

Just a quick note, as a blind person waiting impatiently for the driverless future, there are other uses for driverless vehicles than just making some random person money.
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