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How likely is losing a Google account?

jefftk.com

21–30 of 305 posts

Re: How likely is losing a Google account?

#21

This reminds me, again, that I should look into setting up my own home mail server. Is there an off the shelf solution for this? I don't mind setting up another PC as a server for this, but how hard is it?

I believe your biggest hurdle will be developing the sender reputation for your IP address so that you don't have an issue with email delivery.

(It has been a while since I looked in to this, so things may have changed)

Re: How likely is losing a Google account?

#22

This reminds me, again, that I should look into setting up my own home mail server. Is there an off the shelf solution for this? I don't mind setting up another PC as a server for this, but how hard is it?

If, perhaps, you decide against self-hosting, but still want a reasonably good solution, consider owning your domain but buying a hosted mail service. You own the MX records, so you can point it to a service and change it in the future if you need to (without fiddling with setting up a new mail host). Say you use XYZ mail provider, but they shut down for business. You can buy mail hosting from someone else within a d…

Is it possible to „own“ a domain? I thought domains are basically rented. If you don’t pay (or payment fails), then u lose your domain.

Re: How likely is losing a Google account?

#23
post #12
post #2

Okay, so it's not very likely. What made me transition away from Google/Gmail as my identity provider was pondering the question: How screwed am I if I get locked out of my Google account? The answer: Well, if you're on Hacker News, you may have a chance of reaching a human. But if you broke a policy, good luck. I'm paying $5/mo. for that to not be that screwed. (I have family who got locked out. It does happen.)

> I'm paying $5/mo. for that to not be that screwed (I have family who got locked out. It does happen.) But the article precisely addresses that: For example, in HN discussions people will often recommend Fastmail or Protonmail, but they've had their problems too (FM: 2017, 2020, 2022, PM: 2018, 2019, 2021). Especially given that these are much smaller services I'm not convinced that the risk is lower there. Any syst…

I submitted a support request to FastMail about passkeys not working properly (enrollment failure) for 2FA and had a human response in under 15 min on a weekend.

Re: How likely is losing a Google account?

#24
Chargebacks can get your Google account locked. If you have a dispute with Google and protect yourself by reversing a credit card charge, Google might lock you entirely out of your account. The Google Pixel subreddit has a bunch of people's stories about that: https://www.reddit.com/r/GooglePixel/search/?q=chargeback

Not sure if this counts as "policy reason" for the article's purposes; he sort of dismisses payment disputes. I could argue either side about whether a suspension like this is reasonable. In the Google Pixel case the chargebacks mostly start because Google outsources hardware support to a bunch of unreliable third parties. Some of whom seem to eitiher lose or just be stealing customers' phones when they are sent in for repair.

My takeaway was that if I was ever in a dispute over a couple of hundred bucks for Google, I would not risk a chargeback for fear of retaliation. My account is one of Google's very first, when I worked there I launched one of the first products to ever use a Google account. I have no faith that as an outsider now I'd ever get a reasonable hearing over an account dispute.

Re: How likely is losing a Google account?

#25
post #12
post #2

Okay, so it's not very likely. What made me transition away from Google/Gmail as my identity provider was pondering the question: How screwed am I if I get locked out of my Google account? The answer: Well, if you're on Hacker News, you may have a chance of reaching a human. But if you broke a policy, good luck. I'm paying $5/mo. for that to not be that screwed. (I have family who got locked out. It does happen.)

> I'm paying $5/mo. for that to not be that screwed (I have family who got locked out. It does happen.) But the article precisely addresses that: For example, in HN discussions people will often recommend Fastmail or Protonmail, but they've had their problems too (FM: 2017, 2020, 2022, PM: 2018, 2019, 2021). Especially given that these are much smaller services I'm not convinced that the risk is lower there. Any syst…

I'm a Fastmail customer, and it's pretty easy to talk to a human. They don't always fix my issue quickly, but I can at least get a hold of a human within 24 hours.

Re: How likely is losing a Google account?

#26
I feel like this is interesting anecdotal evidence, but its asking the wrong question: what is the risk of losing a google account. if the scope and impact of the loss is significant enough (and in most cases it poses a serious impediment) then you may wish to revisit the google offered service entirely. It is well documented that google accounts can be rescinded for any number of arbitrary reasons, and remediation is either time consuming and cumbersome or entirely impossible.

There is a strong consensus forming in the tech community that core services like email or authentication should be delegated to google only as a last resort.

Re: How likely is losing a Google account?

#27
I am amused by the way HN collectively expresses contradictory opinions on this topic. When presented as getting locked out of Google, a vanishingly small probability of losing access to your account, sometimes only temporarily and often through the fault of the user, is a crime against humanity. When framed as American-style "voter ID", a 15% false positive rate is just the natural price of ballot security. Maybe the sets of commenters on the two categories of articles are disjoint, but I still find it puzzling.

Re: How likely is losing a Google account?

#28
post #2

Okay, so it's not very likely. What made me transition away from Google/Gmail as my identity provider was pondering the question: How screwed am I if I get locked out of my Google account? The answer: Well, if you're on Hacker News, you may have a chance of reaching a human. But if you broke a policy, good luck. I'm paying $5/mo. for that to not be that screwed. (I have family who got locked out. It does happen.)

Hackernews made me realize manual recovery should never be a thing. My first account was taken over by a scammer even with a unique password. I suspect the admins of this site 'manually recovered' my account and gave it to them. The last message of my first account, areallygoodname, is spam. I couldn't be bothered getting the admins to recover it back. I just took the lesson that hackernews is really insecure due to…

At the end of the day, you either have onerous procedures to recover an account--notarized signatures and the like--or you just don't allow it at all. Or there's always going to be some susceptibility to sophisticated social engineering.

Re: How likely is losing a Google account?

#29

It's true that every service has to deal with the same policy and lockout problems, but that doesn't lead to the conclusion that the risk is the same. I pay for FastMail because 1. if something goes wrong, I can reach a human without needing to write a viral blog post first. Other services pay for a customer service department. 2. I trust FastMail more to not shut down their product because they got bored. Sure Gmail…

"I can reach a human" is a huge security vuln. I don't want people social engineering my identity provider.

Re: How likely is losing a Google account?

#30
I find that owning the email address domain it is safe enough with any decent provider. If you get locked out just change the provider and dns configuration.

Even if you are storing passwords in Google account you should be able to reset all of them since you have access to the email.

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