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Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

latimes.com

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Re: Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

#61

Post by Quarrelsome »

cmrdporcupine wrote: post #39
Quarrelsome wrote: post #24

does this imply the lay-offs were a product of collusion at the executive level across the entire sector? If anyone could find evidence of that it would be extremely news-worthy. If I might adorn my hat of tin-foil for a second; at a big corp I used to work at, I heard execs predicting this outcome back in early 2022 in combination with being incredibly relaxed about the employment market being extremely hot at the t…

I mean, it's not the first time that SV execs have colluded. See also infamous Eric Schmidt / Steve Jobs non-poaching agreement that leaked. But I also don't think explicit collusion is actually necessary. Once one does it, the others can follow without fear of losing staff to the others. Meta and Twitter started the fire, the others can just toss in some logs. So it has the effective material results as if there was…

> Once one does it, the others can follow without fear of losing staff to the others.

I agree but at the same time there was noise from the boardroom throughout the industry even BEFORE these layoffs at Meta, that this was coming.

I'm not convinced that Twitter is necessarily as relevant a data point given they were actually burning cash at the time and its understandable that a new (and possibly even reluctant) owner might want to rectify that.

Re: Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

#62

Post by cjbgkagh »

Phlarp wrote: post #20

Guess tech workers should have unionized when they had the chance. As if capital was going to let the most powerful group of workers that's ever existed continue to slip their noose

I think there has been a cynical push for unions to adopt DEI policies in order to make them less palatable. This seems to have been effective.

Re: Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

#63

Post by bedhead »

Ahhh, legacy mainstream media, where tech companies doing desperately needed layoffs just like practically every company in the world over an economic cycle is a nothing more than a singular conspiracy to "crush worker power." Never change my liberal echo chamber journalist friends, never change...

Re: Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

#64

Post by toomuchtodo »

AnEro wrote: post #44
Phlarp wrote: post #20

Guess tech workers should have unionized when they had the chance. As if capital was going to let the most powerful group of workers that's ever existed continue to slip their noose

Doubt that will happen, we still go to this VC's website for content aggregation. Most are caught in hustle culter and want to be, and others are doing it for independance and power and won't want a union. Ultimately I don't think our type of nerds will get together on this style of politics

Important to keep in mind this forum’s audience is a minority in everything except said forum’s viewership.

If you’re taking anything from it besides ideas, entertainment, and a dopamine hit, you’re doing it wrong.

Re: Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

#65

Post by dsfyu404ed »

pm90 wrote: post #35
Quarrelsome wrote: post #24

does this imply the lay-offs were a product of collusion at the executive level across the entire sector? If anyone could find evidence of that it would be extremely news-worthy. If I might adorn my hat of tin-foil for a second; at a big corp I used to work at, I heard execs predicting this outcome back in early 2022 in combination with being incredibly relaxed about the employment market being extremely hot at the t…

It would be difficult to prove active collusion, its more like institutionalized collusion, and I doubt that's a crime. e.g. the same consulting firms are hired by all companies, and they will give the same advice when dealing with falling revenues, plunging stock prices etc.

Nobody needs to collude or conspire when interests align.

Re: Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

#66

Post by CoastalCoder »

gilbert_vanova wrote: post #11

I had a manager namecheck the layoffs as a reason they don't need to move on addressing any of our team's concerns about working conditions. Same manager invoked the Nuremburg Defense the other day. Trying times.

> I had a manager namecheck the layoffs as a reason they don't need to move on addressing any of our team's concerns about working conditions.

What does "namecheck" mean in this context?

Re: Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

#67

Post by kerkeslager »

gilbert_vanova wrote: post #17
pmarreck wrote: post #6

This claim violates Hanlon’s Razor “Never attribute to malice, that which can adequately be explained by incompetence.” Over-hiring, over-salarying and not anticipating the consequences of a pandemic and post-pandemic on business might qualify as “incompetence” The thing that bothers me is this tone I'm seeing online and in particular in this discussion where people presume that a salary is owed no matter what, and t…

I have a recent counter razor: "Never attribute to malice or stupidity what is better explained by self-interest" Many of these orgs laying off thousands have fallen into the depths of a moral maze -- where rational thinking is just impossible and all that's left is self-preservation.

I'm not sure that there's a pragmatic difference between harming people out of malice and harming people out of self-interest.

If someone causes harm out of ignorance (a better word than stupidity, in my opinion), then they can be educated and they'll likely stop causing harm.

If someone causes harm out of self-interest or malice, it can be assumed that they'll continue causing that harm and there's no simple remedy. I do think that selfish or malicious people can change, but the solutions take time, and in the mean time they continue to cause harm if not removed from the situation.

Re: Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

#68

Post by Quarrelsome »

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #65
pm90 wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It would be difficult to prove active collusion, its more like institutionalized collusion, and I doubt that's a crime. e.g. the same consulting firms are hired by all companies, and they will give the same advice when dealing with falling revenues, plunging stock prices etc.

Nobody needs to collude or conspire when interests align.

that's not necessarily true, as timing still can matter.

Re: Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

#69

Post by bitwize »

bedhead wrote: post #63

Ahhh, legacy mainstream media, where tech companies doing desperately needed layoffs just like practically every company in the world over an economic cycle is a nothing more than a singular conspiracy to "crush worker power." Never change my liberal echo chamber journalist friends, never change...

I hear DEI initiatives in HR departments were particularly hard hit. So it's not just capitalists breaking workers' backs, there's a strong current of white resentment as well...

Re: Big Tech is using layoffs to crush worker power

#70

Post by arcticbull »

giantg2 wrote: post #60
Phlarp wrote: post #20

Guess tech workers should have unionized when they had the chance. As if capital was going to let the most powerful group of workers that's ever existed continue to slip their noose

What would the union solve in this specific instance? Tech has had high pay gor a long time, mostly due to cheap money. If the cheap money goes away, how do they pay these inflated salaries? Overall, I think unions can be good because you have clear terms defined in a contract. That provides a more fair environment when it comes to worker treatment, calibration, etc. But I don't see it helping with pay in most cases,…

Nothing to do with cheap money, tech companies are some of the most profitable and revenue efficient companies in history.
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