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A genius at suffering

newcriterion.com

11–20 of 39 posts

Re: A genius at suffering

#11

There is a Polish saying that great Polish literature requires three people to suffer: the main character, the writer and the reader. If all three are suffering book becomes part of the school curriculum.

In Dutch literature it seems that the reader has to suffer while the author describes his newest niche fetish to the reader, usually teenagers in secondary school.

Re: A genius at suffering

#12

There is a Polish saying that great Polish literature requires three people to suffer: the main character, the writer and the reader. If all three are suffering book becomes part of the school curriculum.

Trurl and Klapaucius disagree.

Re: A genius at suffering

#13
post #4

So the question is, how does one maintain hope and joy while taking human depravity seriously? My answer is: by following Christ. Some of Garshin's peers could see this but apparently Garshin himself could not.

aka fanatically telling yourself fairy tales until you blind yourself to reality

And what's it to you? That you have to make snide commments about other people's belief systems? Why are you so hostile?

Re: A genius at suffering

#14
post #4

So the question is, how does one maintain hope and joy while taking human depravity seriously? My answer is: by following Christ. Some of Garshin's peers could see this but apparently Garshin himself could not.

This is the path my parents took, and for whatever peace they personally experienced, it involved just dumping their unresolved traumas on their kids in the name of that deity, leaving us with lifelong emotional baggage to work through.

The underlying ideas that could help someone deal with the realities of the world are philosophical intuitions that need no religion to practice.

While not all implementations of religion look like my parents, it is no more perfect a solution than any other, and seems particularly susceptible to the same malevolence against which it claims to be an antidote.

If you actually are curious about a non-religious path, Sam Harris’ work has resonated with me. The book “Waking Up” is an appropriately named and great starting point.

Re: A genius at suffering

#15
post #12

There is a Polish saying that great Polish literature requires three people to suffer: the main character, the writer and the reader. If all three are suffering book becomes part of the school curriculum.

Trurl and Klapaucius disagree.

Thanks to ChatGPT, we can now revisit The Cyberiad's "poem about a haircut":

https://www.reddit.com/r/slatestarcodex/comments/zaaogd/comm...

Re: A genius at suffering

#16

At risk of triggering an uncomfortable discussion, why does it seem that European intellectuals in general appear more extreme than any of their American counterparts; and Eastern European Intellectuals take that extremeness even further, ultimately creating Communism. Is it "American Pragmatism" that prevents the extreme intellectual from forming in the United States? Is it a cultural respect for complete commitment…

I also wonder why. It seems to be that Europe doesn't like comfort or pleasure. I like the simple pleasure of drinking very cold water, so I keep water bottles in my fridge, and add icecubes from my fridge ice dispenser.

Even separately, these things were almost impossible to get when I travelled to Europe: most bars and restaurants said they didn't have ice. And the cold water was maybe less warm than the ambient air, but not really cold.

I believe we in the US are more focus on pleasure - and I'd roll pragmatism into pleasure.

Re: A genius at suffering

#17
post #16

At risk of triggering an uncomfortable discussion, why does it seem that European intellectuals in general appear more extreme than any of their American counterparts; and Eastern European Intellectuals take that extremeness even further, ultimately creating Communism. Is it "American Pragmatism" that prevents the extreme intellectual from forming in the United States? Is it a cultural respect for complete commitment…

I also wonder why. It seems to be that Europe doesn't like comfort or pleasure. I like the simple pleasure of drinking very cold water, so I keep water bottles in my fridge, and add icecubes from my fridge ice dispenser. Even separately, these things were almost impossible to get when I travelled to Europe: most bars and restaurants said they didn't have ice. And the cold water was maybe less warm than the ambient ai…

> It seems to be that Europe doesn't like comfort or pleasure.

Ah yes, Amsterdam, the city known for its seriousness and lack of fun.

Re: A genius at suffering

#18

There is a Polish saying that great Polish literature requires three people to suffer: the main character, the writer and the reader. If all three are suffering book becomes part of the school curriculum.

In Dutch literature it seems that the reader has to suffer while the author describes his newest niche fetish to the reader, usually teenagers in secondary school.

With the (sad?) consequence that many Dutch people never pick up another book by a Dutch author again. If there is one thing that school taught me about Dutch literature is that I want it to die, and I will only read books by foreign authors (especially English) out of spite.

Re: A genius at suffering

#19
post #13

Earlier quoted context omitted.

aka fanatically telling yourself fairy tales until you blind yourself to reality

And what's it to you? That you have to make snide commments about other people's belief systems? Why are you so hostile?

An empathetic or curious perspective would imagine that they had come to hold a negative attitude toward religion as a result of some experience. If you were asking in good faith, it certainly did not appear so.

Re: A genius at suffering

#20
post #16

At risk of triggering an uncomfortable discussion, why does it seem that European intellectuals in general appear more extreme than any of their American counterparts; and Eastern European Intellectuals take that extremeness even further, ultimately creating Communism. Is it "American Pragmatism" that prevents the extreme intellectual from forming in the United States? Is it a cultural respect for complete commitment…

I also wonder why. It seems to be that Europe doesn't like comfort or pleasure. I like the simple pleasure of drinking very cold water, so I keep water bottles in my fridge, and add icecubes from my fridge ice dispenser. Even separately, these things were almost impossible to get when I travelled to Europe: most bars and restaurants said they didn't have ice. And the cold water was maybe less warm than the ambient ai…

I'd say comfort and pleasure are not elevated with respect as they are in the 'States. Perhaps due to puritanical Christianity and the "Protestant ethic", comfort and pleasure tend to be viewed as luxuries and therefore desirable, therefore within the realm of corrupted desires, and therefore worthy of a form of reserved/frightened respect. I do not see the same value transference in conversations with Europeans.
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