Hacker News Board Hacker News, browsed like a classic message board
Live data from Hacker News

Sh1mmer – An exploit capable of unenrolling enterprise-managed Chromebooks

sh1mmer.me

Post reply on HN
Print view View original

51–60 of 203 posts

Re: Sh1mmer – An exploit capable of unenrolling enterprise-managed Chromebooks

#51

Post by dr-detroit »

blackhaz wrote: post #19
Overtonwindow wrote: post #4

I hope I don't sound like a Luddite, but I don't think kids should have chrome books, or any type of laptops in school...

Getting Chromebooks to schools is the single most horrific act we could have done to our education system. This act undermines the very future of our nations. A big proportion of all the classwork and homework is now done on the screen. There is plenty of evidence that handwriting boosts cognitive processes - thinking on paper is something that the next generation will mostly lack. Rich and powerful are all aware of…

[dead]

Re: Sh1mmer – An exploit capable of unenrolling enterprise-managed Chromebooks

#52

Post by kzrdude »

blackhaz wrote: post #19
Overtonwindow wrote: post #4

I hope I don't sound like a Luddite, but I don't think kids should have chrome books, or any type of laptops in school...

Getting Chromebooks to schools is the single most horrific act we could have done to our education system. This act undermines the very future of our nations. A big proportion of all the classwork and homework is now done on the screen. There is plenty of evidence that handwriting boosts cognitive processes - thinking on paper is something that the next generation will mostly lack. Rich and powerful are all aware of…

I think you'll need to apply Hanlon's razor to your conjecture. Plenty of misinformed "good will" to go around that no malice is required to explain it.

Re: Sh1mmer – An exploit capable of unenrolling enterprise-managed Chromebooks

#53

Post by ceejayoz »

mschuster91 wrote: post #34
blackhaz wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting Chromebooks to schools is the single most horrific act we could have done to our education system. This act undermines the very future of our nations. A big proportion of all the classwork and homework is now done on the screen. There is plenty of evidence that handwriting boosts cognitive processes - thinking on paper is something that the next generation will mostly lack. Rich and powerful are all aware of…

> It is, at least with our school, completely impossible to implement parental controls on enrolled Chromebooks, so you have to trust the school's policy which is, in many cases, inadequate. Parental control is bullcrap anyway - and at least for parents of my age, complete hypocrisy to boot. We turned out generally fine despite having active trade networks at school for everything... warez, games, movies no matter th…

> We turned out generally fine despite having active trade networks at school for everything... warez, games, movies no matter their rating, copious amounts of porn, shocker sites, whatnot.

Since then, though, multi-hundred-billion dollar corporations have arisen that employ vast quantities of employees (including psychologists) tasked with obtaining and keeping your attention on their content and the surrounding advertising empires.

It's not quite the same setup we had to deal with.

Re: Sh1mmer – An exploit capable of unenrolling enterprise-managed Chromebooks

#55

Post by nkrisc »

danpalmer wrote: post #13
Overtonwindow wrote: post #4

I hope I don't sound like a Luddite, but I don't think kids should have chrome books, or any type of laptops in school...

Why? I used a laptop full time in school from 16-18 (and then at university too) and found it much more productive. My notes were better and more usable. For younger children I think everyone agrees that it's important to be teaching computer skills, and that requires computers. Having rooms of desktop computers is arguably outdated, and a poor use of space, so many schools have switched to trolleys of shared laptops…

Developmentally, a 16-18 year old is very different than a child.

I don’t know whether laptops in school are bad for children, but you can’t really make that comparison.

Personally, my belief is that children should learn to use computers (I did as a child, and it was massively beneficial) but that computers should not be central to their foundational education.

Kids shouldn’t learn basic arithmetic on a computer. They should learn it with their hands, with things they can hold, and by writing.

Computers can come later when the math is far more advanced.

Re: Sh1mmer – An exploit capable of unenrolling enterprise-managed Chromebooks

#56

Post by blackhaz »

Retric wrote: post #35
blackhaz wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting Chromebooks to schools is the single most horrific act we could have done to our education system. This act undermines the very future of our nations. A big proportion of all the classwork and homework is now done on the screen. There is plenty of evidence that handwriting boosts cognitive processes - thinking on paper is something that the next generation will mostly lack. Rich and powerful are all aware of…

School should be preparing people for the “real world” after graduation. Learning to think on the computer is a useful skill and 6th graders US (11 year olds are year 7 in UK) have had half a decade of paper instruction. So making the jump at 11 is perfectly reasonable. Chromebook is simply cheap to buy and manage. The point of these is a simple tool, little different than a calculator. If Google offends you feel fre…

I think we all had no problem growing up being ready for IT, and my parents can do taxes online. Forcing kids to do everything online in school and at home is what's fundamentally new and wrong here. There is no option of paper. Of course, unless by "real world" we mean an army of zombies training somebody's else AI and consuming reprocessed digital matter...

I wish Chromebook was only a calculator at school, but kids do research, write essays, projects, solve puzzles - pretty much the whole homework process is now moving online. Instead of really thinking and planning, you're clicking buttons, writing WYSIWYG and drag'n'dropping things around. That's not how we've learnt, and research says there is evidence that inhibits cognitive development. Folks really on top in SV are perfectly aware of that, of course.

What's horrific, also, is that all this is heavily subsidized by vendors like Google. They know they're investing into raising a user base, so open solutions have no chance of competing, not to mention being ready for the task.

This is radically different from microcomputers, the Apple IIs, ZX Spectrums and Commodore 64s that boosted our generation.

Re: Sh1mmer – An exploit capable of unenrolling enterprise-managed Chromebooks

#57

Post by jimbokun »

mschuster91 wrote: post #34
blackhaz wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting Chromebooks to schools is the single most horrific act we could have done to our education system. This act undermines the very future of our nations. A big proportion of all the classwork and homework is now done on the screen. There is plenty of evidence that handwriting boosts cognitive processes - thinking on paper is something that the next generation will mostly lack. Rich and powerful are all aware of…

> It is, at least with our school, completely impossible to implement parental controls on enrolled Chromebooks, so you have to trust the school's policy which is, in many cases, inadequate. Parental control is bullcrap anyway - and at least for parents of my age, complete hypocrisy to boot. We turned out generally fine despite having active trade networks at school for everything... warez, games, movies no matter th…

Time spent on screens is strongly correlated with worse mental health.

So limiting access is investing in mental health.

Re: Sh1mmer – An exploit capable of unenrolling enterprise-managed Chromebooks

#58

Post by gillesjacobs »

blackhaz wrote: post #19
Overtonwindow wrote: post #4

I hope I don't sound like a Luddite, but I don't think kids should have chrome books, or any type of laptops in school...

Getting Chromebooks to schools is the single most horrific act we could have done to our education system. This act undermines the very future of our nations. A big proportion of all the classwork and homework is now done on the screen. There is plenty of evidence that handwriting boosts cognitive processes - thinking on paper is something that the next generation will mostly lack. Rich and powerful are all aware of…

A problem with handwriting Vs pc-note taking studies is that obviously computer-based teaching has not been fully adopted and integrated.

Maybe the problem is not the computer but the broader cultural and technological maturity. I bet with teaching methods directed at information technology (multimodal, interactive text books) and proper learning and attention management skills on the student's end, we could see an increase in learning capacity.

Agree 100% on the detriment of using proprietary, closed source software. As an educator you have a responsibility to not vendor-lock your students and strengthen monopolies. Proprietary software should be outlawed when FOSS alternatives are available. You should be teaching skills and concepts not specific tools anyway.

Re: Sh1mmer – An exploit capable of unenrolling enterprise-managed Chromebooks

#59

Post by kzrdude »

icepat wrote: post #7
Overtonwindow wrote: post #4

I hope I don't sound like a Luddite, but I don't think kids should have chrome books, or any type of laptops in school...

Why? As a student, giving me access to a laptop improved my ability to get things done by orders of magnitude. I always struggled with messy writing, and being distracted easily. Having a laptop let me pay better attention, because I could work on something and passively listen to the class. My notes were also legible, meaning I could take meaningful notes for the first time ever. I could also combine photos of the c…

Not everyone benefits, the computer is just a huge source of distractions and it can really set people back.

Re: Sh1mmer – An exploit capable of unenrolling enterprise-managed Chromebooks

#60

Post by amanaplanacanal »

Retric wrote: post #35
blackhaz wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Getting Chromebooks to schools is the single most horrific act we could have done to our education system. This act undermines the very future of our nations. A big proportion of all the classwork and homework is now done on the screen. There is plenty of evidence that handwriting boosts cognitive processes - thinking on paper is something that the next generation will mostly lack. Rich and powerful are all aware of…

School should be preparing people for the “real world” after graduation. Learning to think on the computer is a useful skill and 6th graders US (11 year olds are year 7 in UK) have had half a decade of paper instruction. So making the jump at 11 is perfectly reasonable. Chromebook is simply cheap to buy and manage. The point of these is a simple tool, little different than a calculator. If Google offends you feel fre…

Handwritten note taking is just better for retaining information. Why would you move to something inferior in sixth grade?
Post reply on HN