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Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

nytimes.com

131–140 of 357 posts

Re: Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

#131

Here's a story about a lost capsule[0] that ended up being made into building material for the wall of an apartment if you think something small isn't worth being concerned about. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kramatorsk_radiological_accide...

The equipment to detect high levels of radiation is very cheap. Likewise the equipment to detect lead... And hundreds of other deadly pollutants. Part of owning a house should involve getting it tested, perhaps once per 10 years, for all these contaminants. They might have been put in during construction - or it might be arsenic in the wood of your bed... Or a mixing mistake while making the plastic for your toothbru…

As long as people understand what's a safe level of contamination. There was a problem in New Zealand a few years ago when somebody misread a document describing the level of meth residue that should remain after cleaning up a meth lab and as a result, a whole little meth testing industry popped up and people were selling their houses cheap because of very light contamination being detected. Even an elderly lady in a state house was kicked out because her grandson had smoked meth while visiting. Turned out, that threshold was much lower than the actual safe level for the initial contamination and all these people were screwed over.

Re: Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

#132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Dang it, I wish I didn't have real architecture design work to do today, because this seems like it'd be a lot of fun to research. Pure horizontal scaling would be trucks with survey counters. Pure vertical would be getting the US to retask one of those radiation-sensing satellites they use to characterize stuff like the Urals trace. (Not that that'd be likely to happen - national security, etc. But have the embassy…

> The surveyors would be safe enough barring a forced landing or breakdown very near the source Weird assumption. Forced landings anywhere are unsafe. They are also very rare, because aircraft are quite reliable. The chances of the surveyors having a forced landing near the capsule must be minuscule (tiny danger zone compared to the extent of full search area, small probability of an aircraft having a forced landing…

Great catch, and you're right: lots of things can go wrong in a desert whether there's radiation involved or not, so we'd have needed those helicopters either way. This is why we work in teams - don't be shy about anything else you see me missing.

Re: Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

#133
post #79

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How did you realize it once contained polonium?

It had a big label on it that said “DANGER: POLONIUM. DO NOT INGEST”!

If only Alexander Litvinenko had such a warning…

Re: Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

#134

Some relevant-looking thing I found on Google: - "9. SEARCHING FOR RADIOACTIVE OBJECTS" - "The first part of this section describes three different airborne surveys that successfully located lost radioactive sources. The three incidents were quite different in nature and provide useful information should similar accidents occur in the future. Section 9 concludes with a discussion showing how to estimate the count rat…

> 9.2. LOCATING THE LOST ATHENA MISSILE" Where can I read more about this? How does one lose a missile?

[deleted]

Re: Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

#135
Here's what gauge sources like this look like.[1] Here are some packed for shipping. bolted to a crate, as described in the NY Times article.[2] The locks are $8 Master Lock combination padlocks, probably just to keep people from opening the things by accident. The lock looks optional on the model in [2].

The lock is on the shutter end, anyway. The cover plate that gives access to the source for replacement is secured by four security-type Torx screws. No sign of anything like aircraft safety wires to prevent the screws loosening. That cover plate looks like the weak point here.

The wooden crate shown is "Type A" packaging, which is rated for "conditions normally encountered during transportation".[3] Doesn't even have to be fully watertight, just spray-resistant. Not super tough, just strong enough to stack 5 high. That's all that the IAEA requires.

So you can see how a few hundred miles on a flatbed truck on a bumpy road could cause this accident. Especially on a decade old source. These gauge sources need a new radiation source every 10-15 years, so shipping them back for source replacement is routine.

IAEA overview of such gauges.[4]

[1] https://www.advgauging.com/product/berthold-7440-d-cr-500-mc...

[2] https://www.qsa-global.com/industrial-cs-137-gamma-sources

[3] https://inis.iaea.org/collection/NCLCollectionStore/_Public/...

[4] https://www.energy.gov/sites/prod/files/2014/04/f14/rmem2_0....

Re: Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

#136
post #127

Really scary. For those unaware of how badly this kind of situation can end up, read about the horrific Goiânia incident in Brazil. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Goi%C3%A2nia_accident

There’s a good Well There’s Your Problem episode about this, if people would rather see a video about it: https://youtu.be/34rdxDgpaaA

[dead]

Re: Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

#137

The article didn't really explain the original purpose of the now-missing capsule, other than it was part of a sensor used in a mine. Can anyone explain a bit more what the original purpose of the sensor it was part of was? What did the mine need a bit of radiation to measure?

We used radiation sources and detectors at the steelworks for thickness gauge - you set them on either side of the plate and measure the lost and from that calculate the steel thickness very accurately. I presume in a mine it could be used say on a conveyor belt where you measure the lost radiation to help determine the density or weight of the ore.

Re: Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

#138

Here's a story about a lost capsule[0] that ended up being made into building material for the wall of an apartment if you think something small isn't worth being concerned about. [0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kramatorsk_radiological_accide...

The equipment to detect high levels of radiation is very cheap. Likewise the equipment to detect lead... And hundreds of other deadly pollutants. Part of owning a house should involve getting it tested, perhaps once per 10 years, for all these contaminants. They might have been put in during construction - or it might be arsenic in the wood of your bed... Or a mixing mistake while making the plastic for your toothbru…

Most Americans would still choose not to do this because any knowledge of a positive lead test means that you need to report it when you sell your house which might effect resale value.

The large majority (>90%) of houses built before 1940 have lead paint in them somewhere and lead paint wasn't banned until 1970 in the US so many older houses still have lead paint somewhere

Re: Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

#139

Some relevant-looking thing I found on Google: - "9. SEARCHING FOR RADIOACTIVE OBJECTS" - "The first part of this section describes three different airborne surveys that successfully located lost radioactive sources. The three incidents were quite different in nature and provide useful information should similar accidents occur in the future. Section 9 concludes with a discussion showing how to estimate the count rat…

> 9.2. LOCATING THE LOST ATHENA MISSILE" Where can I read more about this? How does one lose a missile?

A test fire went way off course

https://wsmrmuseum.com/2021/11/10/in-1970-an-athena-missile-...

Re: Australians scour desert for dangerous radioactive capsule smaller than a penny

#140

> They believe that vibrations from the truck caused the sensor to shake apart and also dislodged a mounting bolt, leaving a hole in the bottom of the box. The capsule is believed to have fallen out of the sensor, through the bolt-hole, onto the surface of the truck, and bounced off into the road. I have a bag of locking washers I would be more than happy to donate if it makes this kind of thing less likely to happen…

For something like this, I'd think you would want some red Loctite as well!

https://www.loctiteproducts.com/en/products/specialty-produc...

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