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Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

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Re: Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

#41

Post by joaorico »

SturgeonsLaw wrote: post #17

For those who are desperate to draw a link between vaccines and heart attacks, this article essentially says the opposite of that. While the paper itself doesn't differentiate between vaccinated and unvaccinated populations, it does contain a graph showing a state-by-state breakdown of acute myocardial infarction (AMI)-associated deaths: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/cms/asset/c0aed082-9f81-4a88... Dark purple is a…

Simpson’s paradox should be taken into account.

If you group the population into only 2 groups: all of the vaccinated and all the unvaccinated, regardless of age; then the vaccinated had a higher death toll.

But age is a hidden factor. The older have more risks and are more vaccinated.

If you group by vaccination AND by age bracket, the opposite happens. For example, the 60 to 65 vaccinated have a lower death rate than the 60 to 65 unvaccinated.

Re: Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

#42

Post by nyrulez »

autoexec wrote: post #35
nyrulez wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think my biggest issue with the whole thing is lack of data collection at the national level about adults who face cardiovascular issues and their vaccination/covid status. If I was rolling out a new vaccine at the national level, this is the first thing I could collect to be able to make conclusions either way. And it's not a complicated thing to collect too. Blood clots have gone up significantly for younger peop…

> I think my biggest issue with the whole thing is lack of data collection at the national level about adults who face cardiovascular issues and their vaccination/covid status. What is your evidence that there is zero data being collected on this? What is your evidence that we refuse to collect this data? I can prove that the issue is being considered along with every other side effect experienced by people taking th…

I did look at https://vaers.hhs.gov/reportevent.html btw. It seems to have great intentions. I have no idea about the level of compliance since it's purely voluntary it seems. I would love to see the data around clots, which btw that page doesn't seem to list as a condition to be reported.

Re: Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

#43

Post by oblib »

alfor wrote: post #9
kettleballroll wrote: post #2

Can't watch from my country, what's the tl;dw? In which population, and are there any reasons why?

Important rise, we don’t know why(job loss? stress?, covid?), we don’t talk about mRNA vaccines.

I'll give you my experience with them.

I just turned 63 and got the Pfizer vaxx and boosters as early as I could. Honestly, I did not have any side effects at all and neither did my wife. We made a point to take some vitamins and supplements for a few days before getting the shots, but that was all.

In Dec 2021 one of our daughters, who refused to get vaxxed, came up for the holidays and tested positive about 5 days later. She was sick in bed for 5 days. My wife and I had to nurse her but we still did not get infected. Neither of us wore masks in the house during that time, but we did open windows and doors to freshen the air everyday.

She's gotten infected two more times since then, and told us not long ago she's dealing with some long haul issues.

I don't get out much but my wife deals with people from all over (we live near a tourist destination) and neither of have been sick at all since before this crud hit.

The only other thing we've really done is keep up on the vitamins and supplements. And really don't even do those everyday. More like a few times a week.

So I really can't say anything negative about the mRNA vaccine I and few other's I know got. None of us who are fully vaxxed and boosted have experienced any downside or been infected with Covid.

Don't get me wrong... I'm not feeling anything close to invincible, or smart for that matter. It's been a roll of the dice no matter what we've chose to do about covid.

Re: Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

#44

Post by kelipso »

faeriechangling wrote: post #31
nyrulez wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't fully understand. Are you saying since vaccines were broadly introduced, they are less likely to be the culprit? How is that implied? 30% increase in heart attacks in young age group is pretty broad too. This study doesn't study vaccination cohorts to imply any association either way

No, I’m saying vaccines are so plausibly the culprit you would want to immediately subject them to analysis as to if they are the cause of the trend asap, but a natural consequence of any such analysis is you are very likely to do the opposite and rule them out as a cause.

Okay...I think I sprained a couple of nerves from these gymnastics but has anyone actually explicitly ruled out vaccines as the culprit of this?

Re: Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

#45

Post by l33tbro »

nyrulez wrote: post #21
SturgeonsLaw wrote: post #17

For those who are desperate to draw a link between vaccines and heart attacks, this article essentially says the opposite of that. While the paper itself doesn't differentiate between vaccinated and unvaccinated populations, it does contain a graph showing a state-by-state breakdown of acute myocardial infarction (AMI)-associated deaths: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/cms/asset/c0aed082-9f81-4a88... Dark purple is a…

It's difficult to draw conclusions because first graph is not the delta in deaths, just total deaths. and southern states have always had a high cardiovascular mortality. I guess the bigger question that I often have is why the rush to completely rule out vaccines? Whenever this discussion comes up, its either complete blame or zero blame. How about investigate it like any other factor with the help of proper data? A…

> why the rush to completely rule out vaccines?

Are you kidding? The vaccines are the most politicised issue of the last 10 years. With the left and right wing media bating their respective audiences with dehumanising terms like 'antivaxxers' and 'face-diaper people', our society became incredibly tribalised on this issue.

Whether the vaccines are or are not to blame, good luck getting any social consensus. This is akin to religion now.

Re: Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

#46

Post by JacksonGariety »

SturgeonsLaw wrote: post #17

For those who are desperate to draw a link between vaccines and heart attacks, this article essentially says the opposite of that. While the paper itself doesn't differentiate between vaccinated and unvaccinated populations, it does contain a graph showing a state-by-state breakdown of acute myocardial infarction (AMI)-associated deaths: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/cms/asset/c0aed082-9f81-4a88... Dark purple is a…

Comparing states is fallacious because there are so many confounding factors. The lowest vaccinated states, in the Bible Belt, are highest for almost all health conditions. People in those states are less healthy period. One cannot draw conclusions that way.

Re: Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

#47

Post by ygggvbbjiuygvf »

thinking4real wrote: post #40
SturgeonsLaw wrote: post #17

For those who are desperate to draw a link between vaccines and heart attacks, this article essentially says the opposite of that. While the paper itself doesn't differentiate between vaccinated and unvaccinated populations, it does contain a graph showing a state-by-state breakdown of acute myocardial infarction (AMI)-associated deaths: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/cms/asset/c0aed082-9f81-4a88... Dark purple is a…

[flagged]

Not saying it is not happening more often, but how often you see it reported is not a good indicator. It is just how the news works, there is now heightened interest in that sort of thing so it is reported more often. I do remember such cases from before Covid.

Another recent example would be „black person killed by cops“ - even here in Germany the latest case made national news, even though it happened in the US.

Re: Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

#48

Post by autoexec »

nyrulez wrote: post #37
autoexec wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I think my biggest issue with the whole thing is lack of data collection at the national level about adults who face cardiovascular issues and their vaccination/covid status. What is your evidence that there is zero data being collected on this? What is your evidence that we refuse to collect this data? I can prove that the issue is being considered along with every other side effect experienced by people taking th…

1. My doctor(s) (in USA) told me so. They were not aware of any data collection around this and my condition. I did explicitly ask them. 2. Where is this data? If it's being collected, we should be able to see it or clear conclusions from it? It's a very simple data set too. I have not seen any clear national level data or any discussion around it for vaccination status/blood clots in any media.

> I have not seen any clear national level data or any discussion around it for vaccination status/blood clots in any media.

In research: https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/35582622/

In media: https://nypost.com/2022/05/05/fda-restricts-jjs-covid-19-vac...

I'll be generous and suggest that your doctor misunderstood your question. VAERS is a nationwide data collection program being used to collect evidence for the adverse effects of these vaccines, including heart problems and blood clots. Your doctor is certainly aware of this program and if they are dealing with covid patients they are most likely involved in collecting and sharing their own observations and data as well.

> blood clots became a concern starting in April 2021, when the government put a pause on the J&J shot after six women who received it developed rare blood clots—and one died. All of these cases were reported to the Vaccine Adverse Events Reporting System (VAERS), a national early reporting warning system to detect safety problems with U.S.-licensed vaccines. (https://www.yalemedicine.org/news/coronavirus-vaccine-blood-...)

Data on the problems the vaccines might be causing is continuously being collected and evaluated. Researchers all over the globe are exchanging data on every facet of this novel virus and the new vaccines we've developed. The possible risks of these vaccines are not being ignored and research is not forbidden. If people are telling you otherwise, you might want to ask them to clarity their position or you may want to reevaluate where you've been getting your information.

Re: Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

#49

Post by steve1977 »

nyrulez wrote: post #26
wazer5 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

How about exposure to actual coronavirus? Most everyone is exposed at least to small degrees on a daily/weekly basis given the levels in air.

Yes, that's definitely possible. All of this would be much easier to decipher if the studies went deeper into cohorts of who got the vaccination and where the heart attack delta is. So if you had 4 cohorts of people and noticed their heart attack delta: covid/no vaccine, no covid/no vaccine, covid/vaccine, no covid/vaccine, that itself would tell you a lot. Because if no covid/vaccine is showing a much higher or simi…

Can we reliably detect if someone was vaccinated but not exposed to the actual virus?

Re: Heart attacks on rise for 25-44 age group

#50

Post by [deleted] »

thinking4real wrote: post #40
SturgeonsLaw wrote: post #17

For those who are desperate to draw a link between vaccines and heart attacks, this article essentially says the opposite of that. While the paper itself doesn't differentiate between vaccinated and unvaccinated populations, it does contain a graph showing a state-by-state breakdown of acute myocardial infarction (AMI)-associated deaths: https://onlinelibrary.wiley.com/cms/asset/c0aed082-9f81-4a88... Dark purple is a…

[flagged]

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