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High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

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Re: High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

#131

Post by 52-6F-62 »

ren_engineer wrote: post #43
mrandish wrote: post #8

> "High-earning men in the 25-to-39 age range who could be described as “workaholics” were pulling back, often by choice" This seems like great news. I know several guys who've recently opted to earn less in exchange for more time off at home with their young kids. They are happier and the kids love it.

the last sentence of the article hints at the real reason it was written in the first place: >But as staff cut back their hours, it costs medical organizations money it's just companies screeching that they are making less money because salaried employees are doing less unpaid work. I think the pandemic had a large effect on people in terms of 1. Having to face potential mortality much earlier than expected and thus…

It’s not their potential mortality. It is their mortality. Very real, and always imminent.

Once it stops becoming a “potential” thing, and it’s accepted as reality, then you start making real choices.

The outcome is telling but not surprising. It’s among the oldest human wisdom.

Re: High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

#132

Post by RobinL »

bradlys wrote: post #75
xyzelement wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nearsighted view that's probably not common among those raised with a long term values perspective. Being a broke bartender is maybe cute in your 20s and maybe they are enjoying the "great women" they are dating. The problem is - once you hit 30 and beyond, being a broke bartender ain't that cute, and the kind of women stuck dating them aren't that *great" either. And there's no easy leap from a broke bartender in yo…

I’d also argue that for young men - unless you’re an absolute unit and breathtakingly handsome… you’re always going to need to make more than your partner for a long term relationship. Being a bartender or taking a lower wage job is a surefire way to only being able to sleep around. I’ve only met a few women who earn more than their spouse and can actually only think of one off the top of my head. Every other couple…

Given that women on average don't earn that much less than men, it can't be that rare for women to earn more than their male partner

Re: High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

#133

Post by luckylion »

pessimizer wrote: post #71
luckylion wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah, those right-leaning media companies and their constant bashing of the checks notes top 10% earners.

There's nothing that the right likes more than bashing lazy elites.

The lazy elites working 70+ hours per week? I must've missed all those smear campaigns against upper management, investment bankers, corporate lawyers etc.

Re: High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

#134

Post by kerkeslager »

Good.

It has become clear that the rich aren't going to give the rest of us any of the profits gained as automation makes things more efficient. The only way normal people gain from improvements is if we collectively refuse to work more than we're paid for.

This also smooths the transition to a future in which all work is automated and no one needs to work. That future it far away but it is coming. As less and less human labor is necessary to provide for our survival needs, people should be working fewer and fewer hours and still being able to survive. The alternative is more and more unemployment, with the unemployed being unable to survive, and a ruling class that doesn't work yet touts the need for work because they benefit from labor.

Re: High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

#135

Post by nixgeek »

xyzelement wrote: post #130
nixgeek wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This in itself is a huge problem and addressing it requires some combination of: (i) regulation backed up with investigations and significant fines for violation; (ii) transparency into pay equity; (iii) corporate action, optimally because it’s the right thing, but pessimistically because you can’t ignore the prior two points.

Why is it a huge problem?

Why is it normal or acceptable that men earn more than women? It’s been studied for a long time and there’s evidence [1] of some closure across recent censuses, but we’re far from done.

[1] https://www.census.gov/library/stories/2022/03/what-is-the-g...

Re: High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

#136

Post by nobodyandproud »

Yeah, nah.

I hired an engineer that I can best describe as lazy, and not in the good way.

Thanks to drinking the agile kool aid, it’s easy for engineers to coast and I have to remind the engineers individually that when someone else coasts they all suffer.

Context: 8 hour days and correct estimates are all I ask for.

Re: High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

#137

Post by zozbot234 »

aqme28 wrote: post #118
sandworm101 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Earnings from inheritance have almost certainly dropped as a percentage of total income. Inheritance is generational. The huge number of millionaires and billionaires created in the last thirty years haven't had time to die and leave that money to their kids. A few million inherited 40 years ago, mostly in family real estate, is now worth 100s of millions. But that new money probably hasn't yet passed to the next gen…

https://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/sites/0dee8dce-en/index.html?i... Looks like about 60% of wealth in the US is inherited, and the proportion has been climbing.

Do we have to constantly remind people here that wealth != income? Inheritances are wealth. They might have grown in income terms simply because interest rates are on a secular decline (recent short-term raises notwithstanding) and low interest rates boost the value of assets. Comparing wealth stocks and income flows makes little sense in general.

Re: High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

#138

Post by sandworm101 »

aqme28 wrote: post #118
sandworm101 wrote: post #107

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Earnings from inheritance have almost certainly dropped as a percentage of total income. Inheritance is generational. The huge number of millionaires and billionaires created in the last thirty years haven't had time to die and leave that money to their kids. A few million inherited 40 years ago, mostly in family real estate, is now worth 100s of millions. But that new money probably hasn't yet passed to the next gen…

https://www.oecd-ilibrary.org/sites/0dee8dce-en/index.html?i... Looks like about 60% of wealth in the US is inherited, and the proportion has been climbing.

Inherited wealth is different than income. If I inherit a million dollar house, then sit on it for twenty years until it is a 10-million dollar house, I have 10-milion in inherited wealth but only 1m of "income" (IRS taxable income). The next 9 of income will only come if/when I sell the house. So comparisons between inherited wealth and actual income across decades are very very tricky.

Re: High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

#139

Post by thatfrenchguy »

xyzelement wrote: post #53
greatpostman wrote: post #21

Controversial opinion: Men are concluding that women don’t care about money as much as they used to, and having an amazing career to snag a great woman is no longer the best (or even a good) strategy. In some ways, being a dedicated corporate employee makes you unattractive as a person. I know a lot of guys in their late 20s that think this. And I know a lot of broke bar tenders dating great women. Unless you are mak…

Nearsighted view that's probably not common among those raised with a long term values perspective. Being a broke bartender is maybe cute in your 20s and maybe they are enjoying the "great women" they are dating. The problem is - once you hit 30 and beyond, being a broke bartender ain't that cute, and the kind of women stuck dating them aren't that *great" either. And there's no easy leap from a broke bartender in yo…

I love how you cannot imagine a world where the women is the high earned, pretty insanely conservative to me.

Re: High-Earning Men Are Cutting Back on Their Working Hours

#140

Post by alistairSH »

dqpb wrote: post #104
shadowgovt wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Possibly. The work attire for technical professionals shifted from suits and ties to jeans and t-shirts because the power shifted from Wall Streeters to Silicon Valley hippies as the value added to the economy by computers grew. This smells like another work-cultural element that could shift easily if several startup-types declare four-day work weeks and find themselves enough runway money to get to revenue-positive.…

Arguably, suit and ties aren't clothes, they're costumes. They were bound to phase out eventually.

Yep. Suits, Patagucci vests, jeans+hoodie, etc. Its all costumes used to signal tribe membership.

I spent most of last week in all-day meetings with executives, senior consultants, and engineering managers. Each group dressed distinctively. It’s been 3 years since I attended such meetings in person and I’d forgotten…

Execs - suits with open collar/no tie, dress watches (Tag, Rolex, etc)

Consultants - slacks and jacket. Casual shoes (but not sneakers). Apple Watches.

Engineering - jeans and sneakers. Apple Watches.

Not hard and fast rules, but definitely a pattern.

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