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Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

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Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#131

Post by Karrot_Kream »

cma wrote: post #113
Karrot_Kream wrote: post #100

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, but the outrage from this change came about revoking the license for past works. By putting SRD 5.1 under CC, the situation for many indie creators of working with the SRD becomes clean and clear. Hasbro can do whatever they want going forward with D&D.

Game rules/mechanics usually can't be copyrighted other than just the literal text of descriptions of them. Does this give anything you couldn't have by cloning the rules with different wording flair?

The thing is, compatibility with D&D wasn't necessarily about mechanics. Fundamentally TTRPG mechanics are really just about simulating probability distributions with dice. There's the broader question of how to use a given probability distribution where.

What D&D editions do is develop a set of base mechanics, basic probability distributions, and then create a framework on how to apply them. This includes monsters, races, and classes which have particular attributes or play feel. This includes common roleplaying conflicts and guidance on how to adjudicate them. What a lot of indie RPGs that used OGL 1.0/a did is they made references to things from D&D and used them in ways inspired by D&D. Think "elves" or "faeries" being associated with the mechanics and tropes you'd expect. Now with the new CC-BY-SA 5.1 SRD, you can make explicit references to Elves in derivative works and also license it under CC-BY-SA.

There were always completely separate systems that borrowed nothing from the play feel/world of D&D. Those communities/creators had nothing to fear.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#132

Post by joshspankit »

Aeolun wrote: post #129
pdonis wrote: post #121

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'd assume that they could actually have a far larger market and profit by concentrating on scale rather than treating their products as luxury items I'm not sure that's true. The actual bottleneck with these games is not money but time and interest: you have to have a group of people who all like the same game, and you have to be able to get the group together regularly to play it. There are plenty of people who a…

I’m still holding out hope I’ll be able to have a D&D renneisance after I retire (or maybe when the kids are old enough).

I know 10yr olds were getting in to it about 5 years ago. That feels like the seeds are planted

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#133

Post by hinkley »

tonfreed wrote: post #39
pubby wrote: post #34

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> how was the communities' desire not implicitly understood? IMO it's common for people at the top of a hierarchy to be out of touch with those on the bottom. It takes dedication to stay in touch, but even with effort a bigwig can't experience the community exactly as a peon does. Usually, they have to do market research (like this poll) to find out what people really think. I'm not saying this as a defense or anythi…

The least they could do is sit down once a month with the game designers for a session of dungeon crawling. The main two in charge have both said they don't play

The only thing worse than obstaining is half-assing it.

Do you really want a bunch of detached people paying just enough attention to something you like that they feel like they can 'contribute' by changing it?

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#134

Post by wolverine876 »

crayboff wrote: post #33
voakbasda wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yup, trust once broken cannot be rebuilt easily. Too many companies make these kinds of bad PR moves, backtrack temporarily, and then quietly deploy their plans after the initial furor dies down. I wager that the winds here will shift back to blow against their customers soon enough. Want us to believe otherwise? An apology would only be the start; they need to swallow a legally enforceable poison pill that prevents…

I mean, they did a huge thing that can't be backed out of, they released SRD 5.1 under creative commons. Yeah they did some not great stuff, but let's celebrate the successes when we get them!

What about material not in the SRD?

Read analyses by IP attorneys. OGL 1.0a restricts rights; people have more rights if they just ignore it and don't use it. Here's one from the EFF:

https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2023/01/beware-gifts-dragons-h...

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#135

Post by wainstead »

pdonis wrote: post #121
godelski wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The real problem is the managers at WoTC that don't really care about the games. They only care about money. I expect more bad things in the future. The same seems to be true with Games Workshop and I've never understood this. The products from both companies have huge markups (painted cards and pieces of plastic) and I'd assume that they could actually have a far larger market and profit by concentrating on scale…

> I'd assume that they could actually have a far larger market and profit by concentrating on scale rather than treating their products as luxury items I'm not sure that's true. The actual bottleneck with these games is not money but time and interest: you have to have a group of people who all like the same game, and you have to be able to get the group together regularly to play it. There are plenty of people who a…

I will add that sites like Roll20.net solve the problem of online gaming for D&D (and many other TTRPGs), but your points still stand.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#136

Post by wolverine876 »

A reminder that the old OGL (the one they say they will now continue with) is still nonsense: According to at least some IP attorneys, it restricts your existing legal rights for little benefit, and in most cases you're better off without it.

Here's the EFF: https://www.eff.org/deeplinks/2023/01/beware-gifts-dragons-h...

Also, they claimed they could revoke the old OGL at any time; I assume that hasn't changed.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#137

Post by hinkley »

cleak wrote: post #105
SeanAnderson wrote: post #6

The community WOTC built over decades shouldn't have to give feedback that 85%+ identify with in order to achieve results that are desirable. If community sentiment is so lopsided then what was the rationale to make the decision in the first place and how was the communities' desire not implicitly understood? There is no doubt in my mind that WOTC (let's be real, Hasbro) has enough self-awareness to have realized the…

I’d bet they anticipated the backlash, but thought it could be managed - some short term anger followed by long term profits. It so far hasn’t worked out that way, but these are still recent events; they may just wait to roll out changes more quietly.

They might be right long term, but that's 1) pretty cynical and 2) I think they might have just created the origin story for their competitors. So good news, they're making $1 billion, bad news they are now making $1 billion of a $1.7 billion market instead of $800 million of a $1 billion market.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#138

Post by Aeolun »

chongli wrote: post #104
Macha wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

WoTC (and really, Magic The Gathering specifically) is actually the profitable bit of Hasbro. They were hoping to get similar levels out of Dungeons and Dragons.

This is the company that once sold an ancient Roman weapon of war (plumbata) as children’s toy. At least one child died when hit by the dart. The company should be shut down and its valuable brands spun off!

At least 3 children died.

That said, it doesn’t take a genius to figure out that heavy pointed metal darts aren’t the safest of toys.

Knifes aren’t safe for children either, but we haven’t banned those.

Re: Wizards of the Coast Releases SRD Under Creative Commons License (CC-BY-4.0)

#139

Post by musicale »

hinkley wrote: post #124
vaylian wrote: post #48

A bit more context: * Wizards of the Coast (WoTC) has been tasked by Hasbro (which owns WoTC) to drastically increase profits over a few years. * WoTC has been aggressively increasing prices on Magic the Gathering (MTG) and drastically increased the diversity of products. This overwhelmed even people who follow and produce MTG news. Wallet fatique is rampant and people are disgruntled. * WoTC releases the 30th aniver…

Just turn the tap until blood comes out. > Don't mess with Dungeon Masters who know how to call together a group of people Don't mess with Dungeon Masters who have converted their campaign into 2 seasons on Amazon Prime. Just sit back and collect the checks for the free advertising.

Killing the goose to try to get more golden eggs is what idiotic companies do.
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