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Show HN: I'm a doctor and made a responsive breathing app for stress and anxiety

lungy.app

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Re: Show HN: I'm a doctor and made a responsive breathing app for stress and anxiety

#71

Post by insane_dreamer »

lukko wrote: post #17
insane_dreamer wrote: post #10

Very nicely designed. Is there a paper showing the accuracy of measuring breath volume and frequency using a phone microphone as compared to other known methods (i.e, medical sensors, but also more consumer-focused devices such as chest straps)? The frequency seems like an easy problem to solve, volume much less so.

Hmm, I'll have a look - that would be a really good figure. You can estimate the air velocity with the mic (then derive the flow rate and volume), but I'm not sure how closely it matches spirometry (lung function tests)

Very cool. A white paper on your site would help convince those who may have questions as to the validity/accuracy of the measurements themselves.

Re: Show HN: I'm a doctor and made a responsive breathing app for stress and anxiety

#73

Post by lukko »

mtalantikite wrote: post #54

First of all, congrats! This looks great. As someone that plays music and has analog synths, I was impressed you even included a tweakable synth! One thing I was wondering is why the exhale is instructed to be out of the mouth. Does it have to do with needing the airflow to travel past the mic, or is there a medical reason for it? I have a long standing daily Buddhist meditation practice and also have a somewhat inte…

Thanks - really glad you appreciate the synth! I had a great time building out the synths and sequencers

Exactly, so the inhalation is in through the nose and out through the mouth for the app partly to detect the exhalation, but also generally peak flow (which is a bit like lion's breath) and lung function measurements are measured by breathing through the mouth. It would also be great to have nasal breathing detected at some point..

Re: Show HN: I'm a doctor and made a responsive breathing app for stress and anxiety

#75

Post by lukko »

anonymouse008 wrote: post #64

Very interesting concept and neat visuals. Before I dive in, I'm a trained vocalist and breathing is core concept #1. My feedback may be geared towards our line of work, but I believe breathing mastery is analogous across domains. Here are my initial thoughts: Using the microphone and camera makes sense. When the camera required calibration, my excitement grew. Then my anticipation gave way to disappointment when the…

Thanks, that's very useful feedback. At the moment, the camera isn't utilised to its full potential - it is used to guide positioning rather than measuring accessory muscles or shoulder movement. I think overall adding sensors to the experience does add something, and hopefully with more development the app could alert the user to things like hyperventilation and dysfunctional breathing patterns.

Re: Show HN: I'm a doctor and made a responsive breathing app for stress and anxiety

#76

Post by _yb2s »

jfengel wrote: post #43

I can't test your app, since I don't have an iPhone, but I'm hoping you could answer a vaguely related question for me. One of my COVID readings was Breath: The New Science of a Lost Art , by James Nestor. Its author says, "humans have lost the ability to breathe correctly". Like your app, it proposes a lot of breathing exercises. It explains their benefits in terms of increasing CO2 tolerance, and believes that we'v…

There is a feedback loop that characterizes the stress/anxiety response, where people breathe faster, which in turn increases the stress response, causing even faster breathing. People with chronic anxiety also develop decreased CO2 tolerance over time[1] from this rapid breathing, perpetuating the chronic rapid breath.

Breath exercises that increase CO2 tolerance like Buteyko breathing allow one to interrupt this process. It's not clear to me exactly what the increased CO2 is doing, if anything, but it's clear that this works to escape this chronic stress state, which is really unhealthy.

I think the Radiolab breath episode discusses this well: https://radiolab.org/episodes/breath

[1] https://pubmed.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/11015814/

Re: Show HN: I'm a doctor and made a responsive breathing app for stress and anxiety

#77

Post by eatsyourtacos »

SpeedilyDamage wrote: post #70

Am I alone in my overall skepticism around breathing exercises for healthy adults (sounds like you were working with COVID patients, so maybe more appropriate for them)? My understanding is that the research is far from conclusive, and "breathe more" seems like too generic advice to really apply in any specific sense. Just screams, "Placebo!" to me. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/wheres-the-proof-... http…

Ever had a pregnant wife and then one in labor? Ever had a real panic attack and potentially feeling more come on? Ever had a child who is inhaling so rapidly that they cannot calm themselves down?

Slow deep intentional breaths work in the above. If you haven't experienced these first hand, then maybe you think it's a bunch of crap. But it is in no way a placebo.

Even if you are a "healthy adult", I think the point is that you should practice these types of breathing exercises so you know how to handle situations where you need it. Additionally, I would say even if you don't have extreme stuff like above, teaching yourself how to breathe properly even for exercising is very important. It may sound stupid but a lot of people just don't breath properly when exercising, it's not natural.

Just sit there yourself and do some intentional deep breathing for a few moments.. it will feel very different and probably 'good'.

Re: Show HN: I'm a doctor and made a responsive breathing app for stress and anxiety

#78

Post by lukko »

robot1 wrote: post #63

This looks great! I found a bug on Safari on my iPhone where the sidebar download button leads you to the TestFlight beta download instead of the actual app. I'm glad the wellness space is being explored more and more with technology.

Oh, thanks - will fix that

Re: Show HN: I'm a doctor and made a responsive breathing app for stress and anxiety

#80

Post by taylorfinley »

SpeedilyDamage wrote: post #70

Am I alone in my overall skepticism around breathing exercises for healthy adults (sounds like you were working with COVID patients, so maybe more appropriate for them)? My understanding is that the research is far from conclusive, and "breathe more" seems like too generic advice to really apply in any specific sense. Just screams, "Placebo!" to me. https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/wheres-the-proof-... http…

Most of the other placebos on the market have the potential to cause actual harm of the financial and/or physical sort (see for example homeopathic teething drops that contained toxic levels of Belladonna [0]), at least breathing is relatively inexpensive and mostly harmless.

0: https://www.forbes.com/sites/brucelee/2017/01/28/fda-toxic-b...

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