Live data from Hacker News

Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

forbes.com

51–60 of 96 posts

Re: Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

#51

My money is on the side that says they're too far in bed with politics to chance it.

This strikes me as a far more important consideration than the loss of revenue or potential harm being discussed in the other topics.

Blacking out Google's front page will reach 38 Million (or 12% of the population) [1]. Compare that to the effort involved in more traditional political advertising--The largest TV audience is around 27 Million [2] (And drops by 50% to the most popular non-football program). There's also the question of how invasive the ads are. I'd bet a notice on the Google homepage getting in your way every time you do a search will have far more impact than newspaper ad that you skip over once you realize it isn't an article.

We know there's a level of discomfort concerning business's influence on politics. There was fallout over the supreme court decision in Citizens United v. FEC--the issue is being brought up again [3].

Google has a lot of power over the internet and a lot of knowledge of what people do on-line. Most of us can overlook that since we don't see a personal impact (except every few months a site vanishes from Google's results and the owner's blog post shows up on HN). Though they are getting attention from congressional inquiries and lawyers seeking to kill opposing sites.

Consider the fallout if Google went ahead. You have people uneasy with how businesses can effect politics from just the abstract idea of donations being shown a very concrete example. You have politicians with the power to regulate Google being shown that Google can be a danger to them.

I don't see how they could risk losing their perceived neutrality and harmlessness.

[1] Using the statistics from http://google.com.hypestat.com/ for a rough estimate: 129M unique visitors daily, 30% from the United States, that's 38.7M or 12% of the population.

[2] http://www.nielsen.com/us/en/insights/top10s/television.html

[3] http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142405297020436810457713...

Re: Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

#52
post #37

Google might be well served by some sort of partial blackout on its home page, but Facebook would need to get more creative -- and, dare I say it, more social. A blackout of any kind on Facebook would create a minor to major annoyance for an audience that we can presume is largely ignorant to apathetic about SOPA. If, instead, Facebook released profile widget of some sort -- say, a standardized black box as one's def…

I'm a lot confused. Are you saying that people wouldn't notice if you replaced the whole Facebook site with a protest message, but if you offer a protest widget to "an audience that we can presume is largely ignorant to apathetic about SOPA", it will spread like wildfire? That doesn't make any sense to me.

What that sounds like to me is using Facebook as a platform for spreading the message. If you black out Facebook, it dampens the ability for the message to propagate out to people who don't know about SOPA, i.e. a majority of the Facebook population.

Re: Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

#53
post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sounds an awful lot like "too big to fail" rhetoric.

Really? I google medical conditions frequently. I think this is common practice. I have also met a good number of folks (mostly older) who know only of google search engine-wise. Some of them are unsure what input field to type in at times. Comparing critical services to political slogans is mentally lazy. Yes, the power grid in my city is "too big too fail" this winter--because people can and do die when that happen…

The last thing Google will tell you is that they are critical infrastructure. They would never want that much liability or responsibility to be placed on them. Searching for information about a medical condition is something I think a lot of people do, but they shouldn't come to rely on Google (or the Web in general) for that.

The information Google returns can be false, misleading, under-researched, or all of the above. You can't actually rely on the information you find. Even something as simple as 'what to do in the event of receiving a concussion' can be riddled with misinformation. Practicing Web-medicine is illadvised.

I'm not sure if you're suggesting that it was you or I who is guilty of mental laziness but the entire world laughed as we called our banks "too big to fail" and you're regurgitating the exact same mantra. The only difference is you've switched Goldman Sachs with Google.

Re: Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

#54
post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Going dark is not something either company would do Until someone decides that they're hosting infringing content, of course.

I find it exceedingly hard to believe that Google would be brought down as a repercussion of Google. It's very unlikely that any widespread, powerful websites (like Google or Facebook) would be taken down, because removing them from the ecosystem would prompt an enormous user reaction. Say what you will about the intelligence of those involved with SOPA, they know about how much they can rock the boat.

> as a repercussion of Google. I think you meant SOPA.

> It's very unlikely that any widespread, powerful websites (like Google or Facebook) would be taken down, because removing them from the ecosystem would prompt an enormous user reaction.

Probably not. I haven't read SOPA in detail, so I don't know what the procedure is - who gets to decide whether to shut the site down or not? What if the clerk working that particular desk is an 80 year old luddite and has no idea what a google is, but knows for sure it shouldn't be stealing all those movies or whatever?

And what happens to Facebook if I suddenly start uploading video clips from unreleased movies? The obvious answer is that Facebook shuts down my account, but what if some RIAA goon sees it before that happens and pulls the SOPA lever, or some congressman? If they can't use SOPA to shut down an infringing website, how could they have justified using all that cash to lobby for it?

Re: Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

#55
I posted this elsewhere, but I think it got buried. IMO it is worth reposting here:

Assuming this spreads, I believe a potential ramification of major sites blacking out would be new laws that would attempt to make such black outs illegal.

It could be seen as equivalent to strikes in essential service industries like transportation. Such strikes are semi-regulated and governments can and have ordered strikers back on the job to maintain public order. I see this possibility as a potentially major unintended consequence of putting Facebook "on strike".

Re: Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

#56

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The answer to most of those is "911" (or your regional equivalent). The others are not time critical, read the manual, ask whoever you rented it from, or figure out how to use Bing. I'm starting to feel old here...

Whilst you may not like his examples, you do understand the point he's making right?

The point he's making, largely, is that Google going out is a bad thing because people use internet searches as a replacement for common sense. That's not Google's fault.

Re: Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

#57
post #2

It would be truly amazing to see this. Reddit going dark is fantastic, but to an extent it's "preaching to the choir"- Reddit is already the centre of SOPA activism. Google, Facebook or Twitter going dark would be a huge statement. Is there a movement for other sites to go dark on Jan 18th as well? My startup going dark by itself wouldn't have a huge impact, but if it was part of a national day of activism it could b…

I believe Facebook is the least one willing to stand up for civil rights - as long as not about some 3rd world dictatorship. With their ongoing questionable practice in regards to privacy they are certainly going to duck and cover as soon as something controversial comes up. Google and especially Twitter are from my view substantially more supportive to causes like these.

Re: Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

#58

I posted this elsewhere, but I think it got buried. IMO it is worth reposting here: Assuming this spreads, I believe a potential ramification of major sites blacking out would be new laws that would attempt to make such black outs illegal. It could be seen as equivalent to strikes in essential service industries like transportation. Such strikes are semi-regulated and governments can and have ordered strikers back on…

I really don't see how a law like that would ever get past the Supreme Court, seeing as how it's a major restriction of 1st Amendment rights.

It would also be a major signal to every web app out there that this is the wrong country to be in.

edit: wrong institution.

Re: Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

#59

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The answer to most of those is "911" (or your regional equivalent). The others are not time critical, read the manual, ask whoever you rented it from, or figure out how to use Bing. I'm starting to feel old here...

Whilst you may not like his examples, you do understand the point he's making right?

[deleted]

Re: Why Google And Facebook Need To Go Dark To Protest SOPA

#60
Utilities cannot "go dark". The power company couldn't go dark to make a political point. The water and gas companies couldn't either.

Google has acquired (for better or worse) utility status. Interrupting service to make a political point would do unbelievable damage to Google itself.

Better to just outspend Hollywood, if Google has the will to defeat SOPA.

Post reply on HN