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1min high-intensity exercise 3x a week improves fitness as much as 3x aerobics (2016)

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Re: 1min high-intensity exercise 3x a week improves fitness as much as 3x aerobics (2016)

#261

Post by watwut »

this_user wrote: post #248
watwut wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Linking conservation of energy is just non argument. It has nothing to do with anything, because our bodies are not simple theoretical machine.

They are still subject to the basic laws of physics. If you do a certain amount of work, but you take in less than what you have spent, the body has to use its stored energy to make up for the difference. How else would this work? The body cannot magically materialise energy out of nothing, and it cannot use more than what is available in the form of intake plus storage.

> They are still subject to the basic laws of physics. If you do a certain amount of work, but you take in less than what you have spent, the body has to use its stored energy to make up for the difference. How else would this work? The body cannot magically materialise energy out of nothing, and it cannot use more than what is available in the form of intake plus storage.

Your body temperature goes up and down, changing how much energy is spent by body. Your ability to perform goes up and down - you become sleepy and tired, your brain spends less energy and that is that (yes it has impact on your attention and performance). You cant stop it from happening. You may try to exercise the same and can easily become unable to.

Your body gets rid of calories in poo and piss, when sweating or not.

Your body can just turn off functions and generally malfunctions and you dont have direct control over it.

Re: 1min high-intensity exercise 3x a week improves fitness as much as 3x aerobics (2016)

#262

Post by raspberry1337 »

GatorD42 wrote: post #213
cycomanic wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While you are somewhat dismissive about the results, they really only confirm many other studies which found that HIT (High intensity training, what is discussed in the article) training achieves the same effects as much longer endurance training at much shorter times. This has been found for both non-athletes and athletes and in fact training for professional endurance athletes has drastically changed in the last 5-…

Athletes are not training less at higher intensities overall. The dominant paradigm is polarized training - huge amounts of low intensity with small amounts of high intensity mixed in. https://www.outsideonline.com/health/training-performance/po...

To add further, research has gone further into how intensity and low intensity improves different things - different fibres, genetics, factors of health etc. Heavy lifting affects fibers that are not affected by high-rep medium-low lifting, for example.

Huberman lab and The Drive podcast that I have listened to have had several academics in this field discuss the divergent effects of different modes of training.

Re: 1min high-intensity exercise 3x a week improves fitness as much as 3x aerobics (2016)

#263

Post by infamousclyde »

paulcole wrote: post #186
twawaaay wrote: post #128

Everybody knows that high intensity exercise does more than low intensity ones per hour invested. At least in running world. The issues are, and especially when you are out of shape: * adherence -- it is difficult to keep people do hard, high intensity exercises regularly. Part of being a runner is learning to deal with pain but people who are out of shape are almost by definition new to this and are not yet accustom…

> Everybody knows that high intensity exercise does more than low intensity ones per hour invested. At least in running world. “Does more” is hella vague. As a 40-mile a week runner I find that low intensity runs “do more” for me because they’re more relaxing.

I mean, I think I understand what they're saying. A thirty minute tempo will develop your aerobic capacity more than a thirty minute easy run-- more or less analogous to progressive overload in weightlifting. That's not to say that you can't grow/improve as a runner without challenging sessions, but I imagine the rate of improvement would be significantly lower. Pro runners would be doing as many workouts as possible per week if recovery weren't an issue!

Re: 1min high-intensity exercise 3x a week improves fitness as much as 3x aerobics (2016)

#264

Post by jokethrowaway »

dmix wrote: post #159
cycomanic wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While you are somewhat dismissive about the results, they really only confirm many other studies which found that HIT (High intensity training, what is discussed in the article) training achieves the same effects as much longer endurance training at much shorter times. This has been found for both non-athletes and athletes and in fact training for professional endurance athletes has drastically changed in the last 5-…

> without making your calorie intake less than your expenditure you will not loose weight I've asked on HN a couple times in the past for citations that support this meme and haven't yet found a good source on this. The connection between caloric restriction and weight loss isn't as straight forward as people seem to think, despite that being the standard correlation pushed since the 1950s. Calories seems to be the c…

Calories are a good enough metric. There are exceptions: It's hard to calculate how much energy your body will spend to digest food burning energy in the process. Eg. nuts are high calories but also increase the amount of energy you're burning.

If you worry about macros (eg. hitting your proteins) you can get even better results by building muscle (which increases your metabolism and make you burn more fat) and avoiding a bunch of health issues likely linked to eating modern processed crap.

That said, the phrase: > without making your calorie intake less than your expenditure you will not loose weight

is correct and not a meme. It's just that your expenditure is hard to track and can be influenced by a lot of factors.

What I found that works wonders is to: - 1. keep your diet and fitness regimen as constant as possible, no matter what it is - 2. swap food with lower calories and higher protein intake, while trying to avoid processed food - 3. increase exercise without adding food - 4. measure your weight every morning at the same time - 5. do that until you stop gaining weight and your weight is constant for a few weeks - 6. reduce calories by doing step 2 or 3 again until you start losing a bit of weight - 7. keep doing it until you hit your target weight

I did this to lose weight years ago and it worked well. The main advantage is you don't have to worry about counting calories.

Last year instead I just went carnivore (admittedly, I did it to sort out other health issues, the weight loss was a welcome side benefit) and I found myself feeling full (thanks to the higher fat intake) and eating a sensible amount of meat, which helped me lose 10kgs over ~10 weeks. I'm sure not eating carbs (ketosis) also played a role.

Re: 1min high-intensity exercise 3x a week improves fitness as much as 3x aerobics (2016)

#265

Post by SamoyedFurFluff »

watwut wrote: post #247
SamoyedFurFluff wrote: post #238

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually speaking as someone who is trying to become less sedentary the issue for me is a lack of knowledge, not a lack of time or whatever. I literally didn’t know what exercise was appropriate or even how to perform the ritual around exercise and everyone’s “just do something” was supremely unhelpful. I didn’t know what was normal soreness and what was an injury. I didn’t know what’s an appropriate warmup or cooldo…

There are channels on youtube with prepared sets of workouts. I have seen people follow them with success. And also, I used app (freeletics, but there are plenty of others) to give me workouts which worked well for me.

Prepared sets don’t tel you about fueling yourself so you don’t feel too faint to continue, what’s soreness vs injury, etc. they also don’t confirm whether or not your form is good, so you can often injure yourself because super out of shape people very rarely have the body awareness/coordination to be able to self correct.

Re: 1min high-intensity exercise 3x a week improves fitness as much as 3x aerobics (2016)

#266

Post by snovv_crash »

matsemann wrote: post #145
scott_w wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, this is a common theme I see. People who know nothing about exercise take real medical things that happen to people who massively overtrain and assume it can happen to a regular unfit person exercising for 10 minutes a day. For the 3x20s intervals, the max effort of a person is far, far, below the max effort that, say, I can put out (as a trained cyclist). I strongly doubt the people doing this were actually push…

The rabdo I'm talking about doesn't just happen to people that overtrain on a regular basis. It happens often to beginners doing their first workout at a gym being pushed to hard. But I agree, for 1 minute total effort it's probably not a risk. My comment was more in the general sense of giving untrained people high intensity workouts, especially in a group context where they take it too far (like crossfit).

I've never seen rabdo documented as coming from a first workout. Usually it's from overtraining 3-4 days in a row while being dehydrated, or it's due to an ultramarathon runner pushing through the pain on their 100 miler in a desert, or (much more likely) it's a car crash crush injury.

Re: 1min high-intensity exercise 3x a week improves fitness as much as 3x aerobics (2016)

#267

Post by dropofwill »

sebastianz wrote: post #120
cycomanic wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While you are somewhat dismissive about the results, they really only confirm many other studies which found that HIT (High intensity training, what is discussed in the article) training achieves the same effects as much longer endurance training at much shorter times. This has been found for both non-athletes and athletes and in fact training for professional endurance athletes has drastically changed in the last 5-…

> training achieves the same effects as much longer endurance training at much shorter times The HIIT part of their training has a different purpose than the slower part. Each type of training serves a different purpose. A lot of discussion currently also revolves around putting more emphasis on "Zone 2 training" with many hours & kms trained at lower intensity, for better endurance and efficiency of slow-twitch fibe…

Jay Vine recently said in an interview that last year his max hours per week was 30 and that wasn’t training, it was a big week in a grand tour. His coach at least seems to be on a mid 20s hours a week approach.

Jay implied this was a change throughout the peloton, but you can still see old school strategies doing well (Bernal for example does huge volume in base from strava).

Re: 1min high-intensity exercise 3x a week improves fitness as much as 3x aerobics (2016)

#268

Post by snovv_crash »

FartyMcFarter wrote: post #157
geraldwhen wrote: post #131

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The only person I know who got rabdo was not drinking enough water daily and supplementing creatine.

What does creatine have to do with it? If anything, creatine seems to reduce the risk, by reducing the amount of muscle damage: https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5371628/#:~:tex... . "Overall, the available data strongly suggest that creatine supplementation prior to an endurance exercise challenge reduces muscle damage and inflammation in athletes, both of which would predict a lower risk of rhabdomyolysi…

Creatine gives you extra strength which could allow you to push your muscles harder.

Re: 1min high-intensity exercise 3x a week improves fitness as much as 3x aerobics (2016)

#269

Post by logicchains »

throw1234651234 wrote: post #243
cycomanic wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While you are somewhat dismissive about the results, they really only confirm many other studies which found that HIT (High intensity training, what is discussed in the article) training achieves the same effects as much longer endurance training at much shorter times. This has been found for both non-athletes and athletes and in fact training for professional endurance athletes has drastically changed in the last 5-…

They are correctly dismissive - you won't run a 5k from 3x8mins a week. Nor will you deadlift 500 lbs. Nor will you get a good sport. It's a good tidbit for "something is better than nothing", but no more than that.

>Nor will you deadlift 500 lbs

Maybe not 500lbs but somebody could certainly eventually deadlift 400lbs from 3x8 minutes once a week, as long as they keep it intense and keep increasing the weight. I say that as someone who can deadlift more than 400lbs after many years of practicing around 30 minutes/week. If you're lifting hard, a week is barely enough time for the body to recover anyway.

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