The Disappearance of the Ashtray • Hacker News Board

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#571

Post by LargoLasskhyfv » Tue, Jan 24, 2023, 4:07 PM UTC

bruce511 wrote: post #96

camillomiller wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smoking on planes is absolutely something I can't wrap my head around in any possible way. How the hell someone EVER thought it would be a good idea to let people smoke while packed inside a flying metal cylinder?

It's hard to imagine flying passengers as being a "startup", but it really only dates from around the 60s. Today I know of people who can't fly at all (because they can't stop smoking long enough.) even short flights of a couple hours are out of reach. (I was once on a 2 hour flight that took 6 hours for reasons, and some of the passengers fairly sprinted in the destination airport to get to a smoking area at 1am) So…

Can't they get their 'fix' by applying a nicotine patch to their neck, or something?

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#572

Post by gymbeaux » Tue, Jan 24, 2023, 4:09 PM UTC

chrisco255 wrote: post #295

heavyset_go wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Here's a list of states and relevant statutes from 2017[1]. [1] https://publichealthlawcenter.org/sites/default/files/resour...

Notably, none of those list it as a "crime". Instead, it's a civil penalty with a small fine.

A joke, in other words. I didn't think it was "illegal" anywhere in the US. I'm glad to see other countries take it more seriously.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#573

Post by MengerSponge » Tue, Jan 24, 2023, 4:10 PM UTC

deely3 wrote: post #242

MengerSponge wrote: post #236

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But 55 year olds died all the time from smoking: heart attacks and strokes are smoking deaths too

Are you sure? Heart attacks and strokes main outcome of smoking, not lungs diseases?

You said main outcome, not me. Cardiovascular stuff is really common, but it's a less common association: "breathing smoke makes lungs get sick" is easy to believe. "breathing smoke makes brain leak" takes a little more knowledge.

If you still have doubts, consider the prevalence of vaping. Sure vaping is healthier than smoking, but it's way way worse than not using nicotine in any form.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#574

Post by gymbeaux » Tue, Jan 24, 2023, 4:12 PM UTC

tb_technical wrote: post #174

gymbeaux wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is it illegal to smoke with a child in the car? Not to get political but we can’t even get people in the US to agree to a bump stock ban.

Red herring. It's an explicit right to own firearms in the US. No one has a right to smoke next to a child explicitly listed in a founding document. This is why any gun related restriction gets stiff resistance. Contrast this with smoking - generally seen as a social blight. They're not comparable issues at all.

Both speak to the ignorance and "closed-mindedness" Americans are known for, however I see your point. That said, it's worth noting that those who fight for gun rights "because it's in the constitution" are themselves engaging in logical fallacy (appeal to tradition, I believe), and ignoring relevant facts such as the ever-decreasing relevance of firearms in everyday life, and the reduced ability of mere firearms to overthrow a tyrannical government.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#575

Post by QuarterReptile » Tue, Jan 24, 2023, 4:13 PM UTC

afroisalreadyin wrote: post #435

evenw wrote: post #90

The SAGE consoles not only had an ashtray, but also an integrated lighter. https://commons.m.wikimedia.org/wiki/File:SAGE_console.jpeg

That is rather incredible. "Let us put a tray for an intensely hot object on this security-crucial hardware, because people are so addicted to it".

Rather than choosing the alternative: let's take this opportunity to snub the customer and show that we know better than he does.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#576

Post by gymbeaux » Tue, Jan 24, 2023, 4:14 PM UTC

ac29 wrote: post #220

gymbeaux wrote: post #154

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Where is it illegal to smoke with a child in the car? Not to get political but we can’t even get people in the US to agree to a bump stock ban.

Its been illegal in California since 2008

Sure enough! It's a $100 fine, however police cannot stop a vehicle just for this, it seems[0], so it carries less weight. Better than nothing, though.

[0] https://www.cga.ct.gov/2009/rpt/2009-R-0220.htm#:~:text=The%....

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#577

Post by LargoLasskhyfv » Tue, Jan 24, 2023, 4:18 PM UTC

greedo wrote: post #553

dsfyu404ed wrote: post #446

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't disagree but prior to ww2's investment into R&D, infrastructure and labor force the economics of the industry were fundamentally different. The 1950s and early 1960s were to airlines what the 1990s were for computing.

Pan American Airlines built out a huge amount of infrastructure before WW2 to fly across the Pacific to Australia. They had fueling stops at Wake Island, Guam, Midway, and of course Hawaii. And they also pioneered routes to Latin America. The power and prestige PanAm had is really remarkable.

Remember Odyssey 2001? The Orion III Space Clipper to the rotating space station had a PanAm logo on it.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#578

Post by QuarterReptile » Tue, Jan 24, 2023, 4:18 PM UTC

The end of ash trays coincides with decreasing cash use in my mind. Growing up, my dad's car had a cavernous ash tray (I'm guessing that he removed an insert) for all his loose change and loyalty punch cards.) I don't have any good place to deal with loose change.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#579

Post by mbg721 » Tue, Jan 24, 2023, 4:27 PM UTC

Dalewyn wrote: post #440

tsimionescu wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you expect people who have planned an expensive vacation and booked a flight to cancel everything if they get the sniffles? Should they also self-isolate and avoid grocery shopping, all public transport etc for 5-10 days after their first sore throat? And note, I'm saying this as someone who has just renounced a week-long vacation and two non-refundable flights because I tested positive for Covid, even though I ba…

Yes, actually. If you know you've got the flu or some other mild-but-still-serious illness, you don't go outside your home unless it's absolutely necessary (eg: going to the hospital, buying essential groceries). And before you say "I don't care if I pass my flu around.": Stay home /for your own sake/. What the fuck do you think is going to happen if your mild illness takes a turn for the worst right when you're over…

Oh mah goodness.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#580

Post by TheRealPomax » Tue, Jan 24, 2023, 4:27 PM UTC

gnicholas wrote: post #207

todfox wrote: post #139

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why should anyone care? Let them tough it out.

I imagine industries that depend on tourism would care, if a decent chunk of potential tourists are smokers. I personally would prefer if there were no smokers (I have asthma), but I could understand that tourism-focused industries would be concerned about turning off groups of tourists that include at least one smoker.

New Zealand is an ecotourism destination, officially and explicitly marketed as such. If anything, banning smoking would increase the perceived quality of their stay for anyone in that segment.