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The Disappearance of the Ashtray

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Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#481

Post by tsimionescu »

whywhywhywhy wrote: post #445
tsimionescu wrote: post #308

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's a basic courtesy to wear a mask if you know you have a respiratory issue (whether it's a cold, the flu, or Covid doesn't really matter). Masks work much much better when the sick person is wearing them. I think it should also be something that cabin attendants can force you to do - if they notice you have cold/flu/Covid symptoms, and you are not wearing a mask, they should be allowed to bring a mask to you and a…

Yeah but what you gonna do if they do say no? You can’t kick them off, you’re not going to get violent with them and coerce them so the only answer is turning the plane around if they don’t and how do you think the other passengers will react to that. End of the day the rest of the world has moved on and no longer consider all this an issue and would rather just get on with their lives without inconvenience and yeah…

You explain to them nicely that they will be arrested and/or put on a no-fly list once they arrive at the next airport. It's the same with anyone breaking other rules on an airplane mid-flight - such as smoking, vaping, spritzing perfume or various other activities that are normal in other situations but illegal on an airplane.

How do you think the mask mandates were enforced mid-flight when they were universal?

Also, everything in saying is already common practice in much of the world, especially in East Asia.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#482

Post by tsimionescu »

Dalewyn wrote: post #440
tsimionescu wrote: post #386

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So you expect people who have planned an expensive vacation and booked a flight to cancel everything if they get the sniffles? Should they also self-isolate and avoid grocery shopping, all public transport etc for 5-10 days after their first sore throat? And note, I'm saying this as someone who has just renounced a week-long vacation and two non-refundable flights because I tested positive for Covid, even though I ba…

Yes, actually. If you know you've got the flu or some other mild-but-still-serious illness, you don't go outside your home unless it's absolutely necessary (eg: going to the hospital, buying essential groceries). And before you say "I don't care if I pass my flu around.": Stay home /for your own sake/. What the fuck do you think is going to happen if your mild illness takes a turn for the worst right when you're over…

What about some common cold? That's still very spreadable, but it is far from a serious illness.

Also, if you have mild respiratory symptoms (say, you're sniffling and your throat is a little sore), do you immediately go and run various tests to see what specific pathogen it is, or do you take some symptomatic treatment and go about your life? Why not add "and wear a mask outside" to that?

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#483

Post by Veen »

mkl wrote: post #400
bambax wrote: post #333

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think an accident ever occurred because of smoking in the cabin? (Possibly one because of smoking in the lavatory, and I'm not even sure). For smokers, going 4, 6 or 9 hours without smoking is just unthinkable; I know it was for me. So glad I quit (a very long time ago), but I don't know how smokers deal with it today.

Do nicotine patches, gum, etc. not work? (Serious question)

I find they do not work. I suspect it's because there are two components to continued smoking. The first is the nicotine addiction. The second is the sensory experience. The act of smoking becomes such an ingrained habit it's hard to stop even when you don't feel cravings. And smoking is pleasurable and relaxing in a way patches and gum aren't. Plus, the gums taste foul and make your throat feel weird.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#484

Post by hgomersall »

globular-toast wrote: post #450
nine_k wrote: post #406

Earlier quoted context omitted.

AFAICT nicotine is the lesser evil. It's addictve, and somehow toxic, but not hugely. What makes cigarettes so vile is the actual smoke. The tars, the CO, the nitrous mess that's needed to keep the cigarette from extinguishing. The filter helps, but not a lot. A cigarette without any nicotine would still damage health a lot. Fortunately, the addicts, and those who want the nicotine high, have the option of vaping now…

Nicotine isn't a particularly difficult addiction in the grand scheme of things. It takes most people only a week or two to overcome nicotine addiction. Alcohol and opiates are on a different level. Cigarettes, on the other hand, are extremely addictive. There's something about putting a little stick in your mouth, inhaling, tasting it, then exhaling a cloud of smoke/vapour. I was given a nicotine-free disposable e-c…

And possibly the fact that cigarette companies freebase the nicotine by soaking the tobacco in ammonia.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#485

Post by pigsty »

314 wrote: post #434
pigsty wrote: post #255

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean, unless as a child you had abusive parents who forced you to smoke, it’s absolutely a choice. There are people who can’t stop doing stupid stuff for attention (like breaking electronics for YouTube views or whatever), and we don’t blame “idiots” commenting online for their habits. There are people who refuse to eat vegetables and only eat junk food and we also don’t blame “idiots.” Yes. It’s addictive. But per…

> Countless people never smoked. Countless people stopped. Some people act like quitting smoking is some insufferable thing that others will never understand. Everyone has bad stuff they do that’s just as hard to quit. While smoking is a choice, not all choices are the same. Not all choices are weighted by a chemical addiction, comparing quitting smoking to bad food or exercise choices trivialises it in an unnecessar…

Food is incredibly addictive. Sugar stimulates the same pathways as opiates and provides instant massive hits of dopamine.

Many people who manage to lose weight end up relapsing. Most people end up gaining all the weight back. [1]

It’s far higher than the relapse rate amongst former smokers. And really, just look at exploding obesity rates around the world.

Yes, smoking is a choice. Yes, people will mock smokers for crying and saying it’s not their fault. Yes, admitting personal responsibility and making personal effort is the best way to overcome it. Smoking is addictive, but so is loads of stuff. It sucks, but most people get through life choosing to never start.

[1] https://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pmc/articles/PMC5764193/

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#486

Post by KptMarchewa »

PaulRobinson wrote: post #243
chongli wrote: post #208

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You don't have to ban smokers to ban smoking on a sub. Smokers don't have to smoke, they merely choose to do so.

As an ex-smoker, I'd ask you to consider it as about the most addictive thing going. Think of something you really, really like doing. Something that calms or pleases you every time you do it. Like, playing a game, or reading a book, or eating your favourite food. Now imagine someone telling you that you don't have to do that, it's just a choice. Imagine being deprived of it and being guilt-tripped into it. Sure you…

Food is more addictive, because even if you break the worst habits you have to continue to eat.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#487

Post by MrFantastic »

michaelhoney wrote: post #276
camillomiller wrote: post #88

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smoking on planes is absolutely something I can't wrap my head around in any possible way. How the hell someone EVER thought it would be a good idea to let people smoke while packed inside a flying metal cylinder?

You could smoke on the Hindenberg . Yes. On a dirigible held aloft by hydrogen, they had a smoking room:( https://www.airships.net/hindenburg-smoking-room/ .

Hindenberg got a bad rap. It just happened to look scary and was caught on film.

1/3 of the Hindenberg passengers survived the crash. Way better survival rate than plane crashes.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#488

Post by bongoman37 »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #5

The plummeting rates of smoking in the US is one of the rare areas where this country really shines when it comes to social welfare. Even many European states that have what I'd consider much more progressive social welfare systems have smoking rates that are appalling, often 3x or more the US rates.

Is it really that bad a thing though? Nicotine has several benefits even if smoking may not. There was a recent HN discussion on how current higher levels of adult ADHD may be because of the decrease in smoking. I am a very occasional smoker, maybe I smoke around a pack a year. I dont see any particular problems at my level of smoking. You might inhale a far higher level of carcinogens simply driving to work or hanging around a parking lot.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#489

Post by morog »

Growing up in the 80s people would smoke sitting next to kids in cinemas and airplanes. I always wondered why I felt so sick while traveling &days out to the mall... have since realised it was nicotine/tobacco smoke poisoning.

Re: The Disappearance of the Ashtray

#490

Post by cortic »

camillomiller wrote: post #88
Stratoscope wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Smoking or non? Looks like you're about 25 years younger than me. When I was a kid, there was no such thing as a nonsmoking section. Of course you could smoke, anywhere! Us kids didn't get real tobacco cigarettes, but we always had candy cigarettes so we could "smoke" along with the grown-ups. https://www.google.com/search?q=candy+cigarette&tbm=isch One difference from today was that our candy cigarettes had brand na…

Smoking on planes is absolutely something I can't wrap my head around in any possible way. How the hell someone EVER thought it would be a good idea to let people smoke while packed inside a flying metal cylinder?

I read somewhere that banning smoking on planes lead to a lot of deep vein thrombosis cases, as they didn't need to swap the air out as much leading to higher c02 levels.

But stupid shortsightedness aside; it was crazy, they needed to put the smokers (which was me at the time) at the back of the plane as that's the direction of the airflow inside, but the toilets were at the back so everyone had to walk through the smoking section anyway..

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