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Paper map sales are booming

wsj.com

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Re: Paper map sales are booming

#231

Post by walnutclosefarm »

reader_x wrote: post #199

A cartography professor of mine once advised me to take another career path because cartography was dying; he added, “Google Maps has terrible maps- but no one seems to care.” It heartens me to see in HN comments that some are noticing. A pet peeve of mine is when water bodies go unlabeled. An old-fashioned paper map like the kind inserted in National Geographic mags when I was wee included a breathtaking amount of i…

Google and most other digital maps are indeed terrible maps. They are fine for a certain kind of navigation task, and great for looking up where the Starbucks nearest your current location is located, but for most other map uses, and certainly for actually getting a picture in your head of where you are or want to go, and how that relates to other things that you know or may want to know, or for thinking about an itinerary or even route that might be other than the shortest or fastest, they are terrible.

Re: Paper map sales are booming

#232

Post by SoftTalker »

phaedryx wrote: post #211
ChuckMcM wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty convinced that Google just doesn't understand information economics. In case you haven't noticed, Apple maps are getting better and better and I prefer their turn-by-turn directions over that of Google. The interesting thing is that Apple now offers "explore" vs "driving" maps, I hope they also add "walking" or "Cycling" maps. And because they aren't driven by advertising sales, the maps can be more useful…

I've found that when I'm planning things I tend to use Google Maps, but when I get in the car I tend to use Apple maps. I swear there are little differences like Google instructions will be "In X feet... turn right" where Apple is "turn right at the stop sign" which is easier to follow.

Yeah that’s nice but Apple Maps have also routed me down narrow rural roads, occasionally across private property, and proclaimed that I was at my destination when I was looking out the window at a vacant lot. In my experience, Google’s tech is better.

Re: Paper map sales are booming

#233

Post by ilyt »

ghaff wrote: post #10
folli wrote: post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... and know how to use it ...

Fair. As someone who grew up with physical maps, using them is pretty intuitive but I can see how it wouldn't be for everyone. And, of course, some aspects of topographic maps take some education. With respect to compass, I'm not sure how critical real orienteering is for most people. It's more about not being totally turned around and/or being able to make sure you hit some feature like a road.

Don't they literally teach that at school ?

Re: Paper map sales are booming

#234

Post by colanderman »

massysett wrote: post #161
dljsjr wrote: post #49

Anybody remember Triptiks from AAA? You'd go to a AAA office or call them on the phone, tell them where you were going, and in return you'd get a printed spiral top-bound pad with your trip broken down in to multiple legs, the roads/routes pre-highlighted, gas stops and prices estimated in, a list of sites for stopping off at, etc. All human curated and human annotated (the roads on your route were literally gone ove…

In a lot of ways, electronic maps are still inferior to the Triptik. Even the Rand McNally showed highway rest areas and picnic areas. The Triptik also showed gas stations. Electronic maps often lack this entirely, at least in easy form. The Triptik shows what you need to know while on a long motor trip. The electronic map emphasizes details I don't need. At a glance the paper map tells me whether a road is free limi…

Google Maps doesn't even show exit numbers unless you are incredibly zoomed in. They are near useless for at-a-glance visual navigation.

Re: Paper map sales are booming

#235

Post by brightlancer »

InitialLastName wrote: post #97
kypro wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

My GF has been telling about how there's a lot kids at her school that don't know how to tell the time on analogue clocks anymore. She says it's because kids don't interact with analogue clocks much anymore and Covid lockdowns meant that a lot of kids never learnt it in school either. So apparently there is now a generation of kids who are around 10 - 12 who have no idea how to read the time from an analogue clock.

On one hand, I get the concern about this because mechanical clocks still exist, familiarity informs me that they're easy to read, and nostalgia tells me they're important. On the other hand, they are unintuitive, less common with every passing year, and I'd rather my children get any recess than add "learn to use another antiquated tool" into the school curriculum. I do complicated math for a living, but nobody's of…

I cannot speak for everyone, but my elementary school had analog clocks (which kids learned to read) while maintaining recess, art, music and gym.

Having taught math to children, analog clocks are a great way to learn and apply fractions. I suspect that children's inability to read analog clocks tracks pretty well with their abysmal math skills, like fractions.

So maybe we don't "add" analog clocks to the school curriculum, but we instead replace some nonsense with analog clocks and fractions.

Re: Paper map sales are booming

#236

Post by thorncorona »

phaedryx wrote: post #211
ChuckMcM wrote: post #200

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm pretty convinced that Google just doesn't understand information economics. In case you haven't noticed, Apple maps are getting better and better and I prefer their turn-by-turn directions over that of Google. The interesting thing is that Apple now offers "explore" vs "driving" maps, I hope they also add "walking" or "Cycling" maps. And because they aren't driven by advertising sales, the maps can be more useful…

I've found that when I'm planning things I tend to use Google Maps, but when I get in the car I tend to use Apple maps. I swear there are little differences like Google instructions will be "In X feet... turn right" where Apple is "turn right at the stop sign" which is easier to follow.

Recently I've found that Google has started to put more effort into this area -- I've started getting directions like "Turn right at the next corner after the Chase bank."

Re: Paper map sales are booming

#237

Post by eternityforest »

madrox wrote: post #123
dljsjr wrote: post #49

Anybody remember Triptiks from AAA? You'd go to a AAA office or call them on the phone, tell them where you were going, and in return you'd get a printed spiral top-bound pad with your trip broken down in to multiple legs, the roads/routes pre-highlighted, gas stops and prices estimated in, a list of sites for stopping off at, etc. All human curated and human annotated (the roads on your route were literally gone ove…

As a kid on many a roadtrip in the 80s, I have a special fondness for triptiks. It gave me something to focus on and it gave my parents some peace as I quietly studied maps. I have a vivid memory of going to AAA before a roadtrip where someone would walk us through the route they chose. However, it's all nostalgia. There is nothing about them that I would've preferred over a phone or tablet with working internet, had…

There's nothing about anything that anyone prefers over a phone with working internet...

It's almost like a local maximum, if you plot (total happiness-total boredom) against (total screen hours).

Almost no individual activity is more appealing than scrolling (As we can infer from most people's behavior these days), but people will tell you that they want a life that isn't just scrolling and mobile games, and people are happier when they do more than screens.

Re: Paper map sales are booming

#238

Post by eternityforest »

tuatoru wrote: post #229
eternityforest wrote: post #224

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Since it became unnecessary for most people? Phones can break, so it's always good to know the paper skills... but it's definitely not an everyday thing anymore. Besides, even before phones, it was somewhat advanced, they were never easy, as shown by how often people got lost, and still get lost with perfectly functional GPS just by making one bad turn because their memory failed since last time they checked the scre…

Next you'll be telling me that people don't know how to darn their socks any more.

I'd even argue that darning socks might be more relevant to everyday life than map reading, even though map reading is more important in emergencies and people should probably know both.

If you can darn socks you can probably fix holes in your pants, and if you have a car charger, getting lost happens a lot less than clothes repair, at least in the city.

Re: Paper map sales are booming

#239

Post by vVv111y »

dljsjr wrote: post #49

Anybody remember Triptiks from AAA? You'd go to a AAA office or call them on the phone, tell them where you were going, and in return you'd get a printed spiral top-bound pad with your trip broken down in to multiple legs, the roads/routes pre-highlighted, gas stops and prices estimated in, a list of sites for stopping off at, etc. All human curated and human annotated (the roads on your route were literally gone ove…

Former navigator here ready to go. I was just like that, unforgettable memories

Re: Paper map sales are booming

#240

Post by maxerickson »

reader_x wrote: post #199

A cartography professor of mine once advised me to take another career path because cartography was dying; he added, “Google Maps has terrible maps- but no one seems to care.” It heartens me to see in HN comments that some are noticing. A pet peeve of mine is when water bodies go unlabeled. An old-fashioned paper map like the kind inserted in National Geographic mags when I was wee included a breathtaking amount of i…

It's still very much in the early stages, but https://zelonewolf.github.io/openstreetmap-americana/ is a project to build a rendering system that handles details better. It's using OpenStreetMap data in the OpenMapTiles schema, but giving lots of feedback to OMT when something won't work.

(There's some attempt to make things look nice, but the focis is still on capabilities)

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