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Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

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Re: Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

#91

> Compare that to the Reddit video player This is worthy of it's own question. Why is Reddit's player so uniquely bad? It's worse than any other video player on the entire internet.

Indeed. The behavior I've seen consistently is that the first N seconds play, then buffering starts, and it _never recovers from buffering_. And it has been this way for at least a year. Astonishing.

This is what I get on the second play.

Without fail, my experience is:

Play video. Usually works.

Try to replay video. It stops at 4 seconds.

Refresh browser. Now the video is half the size? But it now plays, though tiny.

I don't know who wrote Reddit's video player, but it's obvious they are a masochist. That they still haven't fixed it speaks volumes of their eng org to an end user like myself.

Re: Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

#92

> Compare that to the Reddit video player This is worthy of it's own question. Why is Reddit's player so uniquely bad? It's worse than any other video player on the entire internet.

Indeed. The behavior I've seen consistently is that the first N seconds play, then buffering starts, and it _never recovers from buffering_. And it has been this way for at least a year. Astonishing.

> The behavior I've seen consistently is that the first N seconds play, then buffering starts, and it _never recovers from buffering_.

It's why on the Desktop, at least, I always have a https://redditsave.com/ tab opened. It's just way faster (and less frustrating). There's an FF extension that automates this : https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/downloader-4-... : which I haven't tested.

*update, a few minutes later: decided to install extension. Looks useful. Now the testing phase...

Re: Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

#93
new companies have structural advantages.

amazon for example is services architecture. many frameworks and solutions built once for shopping/seller use case. now you want to join Y space? incentive to reuse tooling and framework that already exist. get to market quickly. sound like big advantage but the tools were built for problem X. with problem Y, we have hacks on top of hacks to fit square into circle.

“you want to build mobile apps? okay. we only know how to do services really.” so even how you build code or how to branch and release strategy missing or expertise is only in some specific business division who did everything so custom when they invent it first time that it not really work for you.

so if you observe you company like amazon try do 100 different things at once. sound good and impressive and stock grow. but 98 thing executed very poorly and not close to best in class experience.

this my exact experience at two different company.

once you get over these problem, then u focus on optimization. N second videos? Okay.. let’s preload them..let use lower resolution..let’s have warm cache of recommendations if you like this vide, meaning you watch it for greater than S second..let invest in custom recommendation pipeline with online and offline training to expand dataset of video recommendation so u eyes stay on a video longer while we preload next one.

because we smaller nimble build what we need now without politic of tech alignment across orgs and ownership territory battle going up to separate director or VPs.

this me experience and me sure there are other things too.

Re: Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

#94
Because while FB, MS, Netflix, Amazon, Google went woke, chinese look for talents.

And you probably haven’t seen other chinese apps like xiaolongshu - it's algorithms are amazing in showing you content of your interest. Ethically there may be some compromises across, but it does great things.

Re: Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

#95
post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If they weren't using TLS, I'd guess that this wasn't cutting corners but rather intentional to help caching. Ten people watching the same video can get the same data packets, ten people watching the same video over TLS have ten data streams with nothing in common.

CDNs usually cache the plaintext object rather than the encrypted stream. What I’d believe is that they started with a CDN which charged more for HTTPS support - I believe they used Akamai at one point, which would make sense since they had some of the best presence in China in the 2000s and into the 2010s and DEFINITELY charged noticeably more for HTTPS unless you could negotiate well.

It used to be not uncommon for some ISPs and corporations/schools to run transparent caching HTTP proxies. I don't know how much of that still exists, but anything helps.

Re: Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

#96

I'm curious about this as well. Specially how their videos barely buffer and almost instant. you could say that they can preload them cause for you is mostly VOD, but they have live as well and it may not be as instant. its still feels pretty instant no matter how fast you scroll. I don't know how to inspect their app but their website version is using video/x-flv progressive download for playback. which surprised ca…

> 2. I thought the industry has moved onto HLS/Dash or stream via websockets for live streaming.

Industry consensus doesn't mean best performance, unfortunately. Maybe it means works well enough for existing participants, but going your own way can be more efficient or less efficient, or a waste of time. Industry solutions tend to take more round trips in search of flexibility, and number of round trips is a big factor in download time if the round trip time is large, as is common on mobile.

Re: Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

#97
post #63

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You are talkabout tiktok? The search is terrible. You can't order by date, no filters. Has this magically improved overnight?

You can't order by date or filter on Google either. I think the fact that young people use it over google as a search says something.

Actually, google's paid search API can order by date, ascending or descending.

Checkout this example:

https://quackquackgo.net/?q=hacker+news&lr=&qqg-date=&qqg-ra...

Re: Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

#98

> Compare that to the Reddit video player This is worthy of it's own question. Why is Reddit's player so uniquely bad? It's worse than any other video player on the entire internet.

Is Reddit what engineering at scale looks like when not funded by a surveillance monopoly?

Or not funded at all, which is both its curse and its blessing.

Re: Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

#99
post #17

Last week I was travelling on a different country. I was mostly without WiFi and I bought a prepaid SIM card with some GB. TikTok ate 2GB of "background data" in two days, even if I did not open the app. So it's not hard for me to guess how they do it... (Yes, background data is now disabled for TikTok on my phone... I learned my lesson)

Won't be long before some cell plans have special discounts for TikTok data like with WhatsApp. Unless it's a thing already.

Portugal used to have that, but I think they stopped it because the EU said no. Thank god.

Re: Ask HN: Techwise, how did TikTok get so good?

#100

Is the tiktok tech REALLY that good?

i don't know if TikTok's tech is that good or not, but it seems apparent that silicon valley was unable to compete with it until we got even more-massive direct assistance from Uncle Sam and other government entities.

Then how come instagram's Reels (a copycat product) works as fast, as efficient and with the same kind of UX?

Are you saying instagram got "massive direct assistance from Uncle Sam and other government entities"? How would you even come up with that opinion?

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