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The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

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Re: The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

#41

Post by WastingMyTime89 »

TheFattestNinja wrote: post #16

The post is kind of all over the place, more like an internal reflection than a normal message to others, but it does resonate with me on one point specifically: I am an "official" millennial, born 1989. One thing I have noticed (in an anectodical, personal and subjective way) is that my age bracket, especially those I would consider higher on an intelligence/success curve, appear to be so much more closet-nihilist t…

Most millennial parents are not even in old age yet and are statistically more affluent than they are.

I don’t think your analysis is correct.

Plus my own experience as someone born in 1989 doesn’t really mesh with yours. Most of my friends are both what I would call more frugal and more down to earth than their parents were because they had to live through multiple economic crashes.

There is little nihilism but people are disillusioned with the system because they feel it’s setup to favour an older age bracket at their expense and failing to address the most pressing issues like climate change.

Re: The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

#42

Post by Devasta »

Not discussing climate change seems to me to be a big omission. I sometimes wonder if I will have enough to retire on; a teenager today won't have those concerns, as the best they can hope for is that they don't become climate refugees.

Why plan long term in such a scenario?

Re: The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

#43

Post by jesuscript »

onos wrote: post #39
badpun wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It as always like that, so it doesn’t explain why more people want to see the world burn now.

I think this is a good challenge. But also nobody here really proves or argued that millennials are uniquely nihilistic either.

It can’t be proven, but common sense would say GenZ are the most nihilistic because they have to work the hardest to even get to the middle, let alone the end.

I’d say the people in the beginning and end have a tangible resentment, and not necessarily an existential crisis. In other words, GenZ would be resentful of having to start fresh against the barbarian Millenial/Boomer horde, and Boomers would be resentful of any attempt at reformation where their scraps from the race would be worth less.

It’s only Millenials who would neither resent GenZ or Boomers because they were already GenZ once upon a time, and know they have to become Boomers to survive.

That would be my best argument for why Millennials are in some deep psychological shit.

Re: The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

#44

Post by jefftk »

onos wrote: post #39
badpun wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It as always like that, so it doesn’t explain why more people want to see the world burn now.

I think this is a good challenge. But also nobody here really proves or argued that millennials are uniquely nihilistic either.

> nobody here really proves or argued that millennials are uniquely nihilistic either.

The comment starting this thread had:

I am an "official" millennial, born 1989. One thing I have noticed (in an anectodical, personal and subjective way) is that my age bracket, especially those I would consider higher on an intelligence/success curve, appear to be so much more closet-nihilist than everyone else around.

Re: The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

#45

Post by glogla »

JansjoFromIkea wrote: post #28
TheFattestNinja wrote: post #16

The post is kind of all over the place, more like an internal reflection than a normal message to others, but it does resonate with me on one point specifically: I am an "official" millennial, born 1989. One thing I have noticed (in an anectodical, personal and subjective way) is that my age bracket, especially those I would consider higher on an intelligence/success curve, appear to be so much more closet-nihilist t…

"we saw our beloved parents struggle in old age with health and finance", This would vary from country to country but absolutely isn't the case in the UK. Most millennial's parents didn't have their income crippled by rent (with little chance of buying) and student loans (tuition fees only came in in the late 90s), and lived most their lives with a public health service that wasn't being aggressively gutted. If anyth…

Sure.

Watching the world go to shit, watch everyone be worse off than their parents, watching billionaires play games with peoples lives and seeing everything getting worse while the markets are soaring ... of course that would make you think all the markets and money are not real and the world should burn.

The COVID was a cherry on top, "we are in this all together," says the dude on his yacht, while you lost your job and place to live. Now the inflation will deepen inequality and poverty.

I think the next crisis of this type, at least for US (and UK which is kind of similar), is going to be when all the millennials get no inheritance, because the healthcare costs for their parents will basically eat everything. That might be another nail in the coffin of the world possibly getting better for them.

In the Easter Europe, where I am, meanwhile, people are more nihilistic than ever. They were rescued from the Soviet command economies that worked badly, and there was a huge jump in living standards - in the 90s and early 2000s. But by now, the non-freedom of Real Socialism was replaced by non-freedom of being precariat that will never own even the commieblock apartment that people made fun of in the 90s - while all the wonderful inventions of the West like healthcare on for the rich and student loans get imported here.

No wonder people are genuinely thinking watching the world burn in nuclear fire might be cool. The climate change that was the cost of luxury of previous generations will destroy humanity anyway, why not go out with a bang?

Re: The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

#46

Post by pjc50 »

andrewclunn wrote: post #7
roenxi wrote: post #5

This is a blog post that is trying to organise a thought and not quite managing it. There are too many threads and they aren't woven into something orderly or poetic. There is an unfortunately high tolerance of obvious mistruths in politics and finance that could easily be mistaken for nihilism. But it isn't, it is usual lies by people who are powerful. Nothing new. Always been there. Now that the internet exists it…

I think it's confusing cause and effect. Monetary policy that leads to cheap debt for the connected and inflation for the masses is driving this.

Cheap debt for everybody. Or at least everybody that can put a mortgage deposit down.

Re: The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

#47

Post by glogla »

jesuscript wrote: post #43
onos wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think this is a good challenge. But also nobody here really proves or argued that millennials are uniquely nihilistic either.

It can’t be proven, but common sense would say GenZ are the most nihilistic because they have to work the hardest to even get to the middle, let alone the end. I’d say the people in the beginning and end have a tangible resentment, and not necessarily an existential crisis. In other words, GenZ would be resentful of having to start fresh against the barbarian Millenial/Boomer horde, and Boomers would be resentful of…

I think GenZ is less nihilistic, because they are younger - they are not as burned and scarred as millennials yet, and they still believe that things can be changed, that world can be saved.

Millennials already tried, found it didn't work, found it was for nothing, found it will never work because the systems of humanity don't allow for it.

Re: The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

#48

Post by revolvingocelot »

newsclues wrote: post #27
TheFattestNinja wrote: post #16

The post is kind of all over the place, more like an internal reflection than a normal message to others, but it does resonate with me on one point specifically: I am an "official" millennial, born 1989. One thing I have noticed (in an anectodical, personal and subjective way) is that my age bracket, especially those I would consider higher on an intelligence/success curve, appear to be so much more closet-nihilist t…

Lots of people our age feel like the world is bad and unjust and destroying current civilization through revolution will result in a just and good society. These people are idiots who aren’t aware of the death and destruction this will cause and things will likely be much worse after.

Either that, or they're history buffs. What precipitates the redistribution of wealth, historically? Some kind of gigantic disaster -- war, famine, plague, social collapse. There's never been a time when the oligarchs/monarchy/landed-gentry just calmly gave up their temporal power after listening to reasoned socioeconomic arguments. It's always been some sort of calamity. You might find that those idiots are indeed aware of the consequences, but perhaps they look at a longer sequence of consequences.

Unrelatedly, have you ever heard about the way pre-colonization Natives handled forest fires? [0] They, thanks to oral tradition, understood the necessity of allowing -- ensuring -- that smaller, controlled forest fires happened regularly. Not only to provide resources for their society, but also to ensure that the inevitability of a fire didn't bring outsize consequences. Our deployment of modern monetary theory, [1] I mean modern forestry management, isn't actually supported by the long view that the Natives took, but does make briefly-considered sense to the layperson. "Fire's bad, right? Everybody knows what a house looks like after it's been on fire, and that's bad, so we should stop all the fires." I don't think those people are idiots, but perhaps they should reconsider their position regarding fire's rejuvenation properties.

[0] https://www.ictinc.ca/blog/indigenous-fire-management-and-tr...

[1] Huh, I don't know why I typed that at all. After all, we're talking about forestry

Re: The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

#49

Post by annyeonghada »

oneoff786 wrote: post #25

The flip side of this is sitting on a pretty good stable income, not playing high risk investment games, and needing to accept that your social class and wealth is more or less locked in for at least 20 years. Linear gains don’t move the needle. Savings do nothing once you have a house. It’s not a bad place to be, but it is a static one. If you have the ability to appreciate your circumstances it’s even a good one. B…

I wish we had the stability you talk about. Here, not in the US but in a kafkaesque hellhole, our political class decided that the job market should be flexible: that meant that finding a stable employment contract is a farce: instead of having a probationary period you have contracts for 6 months of fulltime work written of as internship and payed as such, and you can be sure the contract will not be renovated so you change job every six month because it is illegal to renovate an internship contract, you offer fulltime or you fire. Meanwhile this "companies" keep churning people using them like almost-slaves because people are desperate: 8 hours a day? No, no: 10 is the minimum otherwise there's something more desperate that will take your "internship". And you end up 40 years old, living with your parents, unable to afford anything other than distraction and then you listen to the TV about the "brain-drain" and start saving money for the plane ticket.

Re: The Scandal of Financial Nihilism

#50

Post by jesuscript »

glogla wrote: post #47
jesuscript wrote: post #43

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It can’t be proven, but common sense would say GenZ are the most nihilistic because they have to work the hardest to even get to the middle, let alone the end. I’d say the people in the beginning and end have a tangible resentment, and not necessarily an existential crisis. In other words, GenZ would be resentful of having to start fresh against the barbarian Millenial/Boomer horde, and Boomers would be resentful of…

I think GenZ is less nihilistic, because they are younger - they are not as burned and scarred as millennials yet, and they still believe that things can be changed, that world can be saved. Millennials already tried, found it didn't work, found it was for nothing, found it will never work because the systems of humanity don't allow for it.

I think one thing to note about generations prior to GenZ is that when those generations gave up, they mostly gave up on the system (too big to be changed). The cynic comes from the death of the idealist, so at some point these people believed in evolving the system.

GenZ believes in people. When they give up, they won’t give up on the system, they will give up on people. I’d keep a watchful eye on that development.

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