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Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

blog.forret.com

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Re: Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

#241

Post by notacoward »

dashundchen wrote: post #112
cperciva wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I have the same experience with my Kona EV. Official range 415 km, but in the summer it's actually ~450 km. (Not that I ever run 100%-0% of course, but I get 90 km going from 80% down to 60%.)

Same with a Kia Niro EV I had, which is on a shared platform with the Kona. I think it was 239 miles EPA rated, in the summer it was quite easy to exceed. I don't have a lead foot and drive pretty efficiently though. Great car, good space, level 2 driver assists and very efficient which offset the slow DC charge speed. Relatively lightweight for an EV at 3800lbs as well.

For a data point outside the Kia/Hyundai family, I get a similar experience with my Nissan Leaf. Nominal range is 215 miles, but I usually get 220-240 as long as it's all at lower speeds. If I get on the highway for any length of time, it's more like 150-200 depending on exactly how fast I go and whether it's winter.

> the slow DC charge speed

AFAICT this is one of the major differences between the semi-affordable EVs like ours and the Tesla/Jaguar/Audi kind. The Leaf might well be the worst in this regard TBH, but I certainly wasn't going to pay 50% more (at least) just for faster DC charging which I rarely use anyway. It's just one part of the overall experience, not worth that much to most of us.

Re: Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

#242

Post by paulryanrogers »

xracy wrote: post #211
paulryanrogers wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Interesting that driving style has such an outsized impact. Perhaps aggressive driving and tire composition should be regulated.

There is no way to regulate aggressive driving other than to take people off of the roads.

Driving is a privilege. Acceleration could be recorded (in vehicle or from intersections) then tickets mailed to vehicle owners.

Re: Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

#243

Post by manmal »

pforret wrote: post #155
davedx wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

When I drove from NL to Paris of course I charge to 100% first. There's some rational logic in the article and comments but there's also some nonsense.

My article talks about daily usage. For long distance travel, obviously I charge to higher % and I use Superchargers. Although even in those circumstances, I never reach 400km between charges, more like 300-350km. Never the ilusive 533 km.

Range depends on so many things - speed, acceleration, elevation, temperature (not only from heating/AC but there’s also increased drag in winter from air resistance), wind, precipitation, tire pressure, tire profile.

You can try following trucks closely on highways, the reduced drag does wonders.

If you have a Tesla, really watch that gas pedal. Strong acceleration is fun but super bad for range.

Re: Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

#244

Post by Tagbert »

josephcsible wrote: post #215
Tagbert wrote: post #214

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Teslas don’t use regen on the brake pedal. That is only using the friction brakes.

Right, but they use regen just by releasing the accelerator. So unless you're hitting both pedals at once, you will be regenerating every time you're braking.

Does the one-pedal regen continue to operate when you are pressing on the brake pedal?

Re: Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

#245

Post by Tagbert »

sliken wrote: post #217
Tagbert wrote: post #185

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, Tesla is an outlier in the EV business. They only have one-pedal driving with regen or fully friction braking with the brake pedal. That is not true of the Chevy Bolt. Almost every other EV (and hybrid) on the market does blended regen with the brake pedal. Regen is applied when you first press on the brake pedal. As long as the pressure is mild to moderate, regen is used. If you press hard (as in emergency brak…

Well regenerative braking is limited and even more limited when cool. So Tesla's trying to train you to use the brake pedal when you want stronger braking. Makes sense to me, last thing I want is to get half as much braking as I expected. So with regen I get variable braking, but I get a reward (more range and less brake wear) if I plan ahead enough to make it work. However if there is surprise or immediate need for…

Non-Tesla’s also give you “the best of both worlds” by having regen on both the accelerator lift-off and on the bake pedal. Tesla only gives you regen on lift-off.

Re: Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

#246

Post by xracy »

michaelteter wrote: post #234
xracy wrote: post #213

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Okay, but what if we could do that in a way that each person didn't take up 100 Sqft? I get it might not be exactly the same, but walking/biking/Public Transiting with headphones in for a period of time is all that and more. And with the exception of a bike, you can do all of those things without having to sit in traffic...

> Okay, but what if we could do that in a way that each person didn't take up 100 Sqft? This would probably make some people uncomfortable, but one fantasy I can imagine which might be nice is to have private transport capsules. We could own our own capsule and decorate/style it to our liking. It has common exterior form factor, with power, plumbing, etc. connectors. We go from home to the nearest capsule station (wh…

I think the problem with this, is that, like the original post states. It's still trying to optimize the horse and buggy.

Anything that's giving you a per-person riding experience is not going to perform as well as batching a bunch of people together for a common ride.

Re: Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

#247

Post by josephcsible »

Tagbert wrote: post #244
josephcsible wrote: post #215

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Right, but they use regen just by releasing the accelerator. So unless you're hitting both pedals at once, you will be regenerating every time you're braking.

Does the one-pedal regen continue to operate when you are pressing on the brake pedal?

Yes.

Re: Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

#248

Post by yellowapple »

acdha wrote: post #240
dagw wrote: post #239

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For me the weakness with public transport isn't so much getting around in the city (I basically never drive in the city), as it is getting out of the city. Getting to my favourite down town restaurant is 15 minutes by car or 20 minutes by public transport door to door, so I take public transport and don't have to worry about parking. Getting to my favourite hiking spot by the coast is 30 minutes by car or 2+ hours by…

I’m hoping there’ll be a more mature rental / car share market, too. It’d make a lot of sense to have no/low-car city centers (e.g. accessibility and delivery only zones, low speed limits & non-prioritized roads, etc.) and more high speed road infrastructure on the edge of cities but the people I know who’ve had significant issues with things like Zipcar reservations seems like the greatest barrier for that. If peopl…

Even putting vehicle storage on city edges (and/or concentrating it close to highways) would mitigate a lot of the problems we currently see with car-centric infrastructure. Even if I own my own car, I don't necessarily need it to be close by if I can rent a garage somewhere - so long as I can get anywhere in town (including said garage) easily and quickly via public transit and/or bike and/or foot.

Re: Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

#249

Post by michaelteter »

xracy wrote: post #246
michaelteter wrote: post #234

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Okay, but what if we could do that in a way that each person didn't take up 100 Sqft? This would probably make some people uncomfortable, but one fantasy I can imagine which might be nice is to have private transport capsules. We could own our own capsule and decorate/style it to our liking. It has common exterior form factor, with power, plumbing, etc. connectors. We go from home to the nearest capsule station (wh…

I think the problem with this, is that, like the original post states. It's still trying to optimize the horse and buggy. Anything that's giving you a per-person riding experience is not going to perform as well as batching a bunch of people together for a common ride.

This would still be mostly a common ride, although the space requirements would be increased significantly. But with the automation and routing systems (and coordination) it would be far superior to cars on roads.

Re: Realistic daily range of an electric vehicle

#250

Post by sliken »

Tagbert wrote: post #245
sliken wrote: post #217

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Well regenerative braking is limited and even more limited when cool. So Tesla's trying to train you to use the brake pedal when you want stronger braking. Makes sense to me, last thing I want is to get half as much braking as I expected. So with regen I get variable braking, but I get a reward (more range and less brake wear) if I plan ahead enough to make it work. However if there is surprise or immediate need for…

Non-Tesla’s also give you “the best of both worlds” by having regen on both the accelerator lift-off and on the bake pedal. Tesla only gives you regen on lift-off.

Not so sure. On other cars say you want to maximize your range and minimize brake wear/dust. How do you drive?

On a Tesla you just lift the throttle, and if that's not enough you are aware of it, and change your driving patterns accordingly.

With a mixed setup, how do you know when and how much the brakes are involved? Doubly so when it's too cold, or the battery is too full for regen.

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