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Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

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Re: Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

#11

Post by einr »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #7

> I'm not entirely sure what other information would be helpful to provide, but I was wondering if anyone has run into this into the past, and how it was mitigated. While we'll always have some piracy, we'd like to keep it to a minimum. I don't have answers but I have a few unusual ideas. I would suggest (perhaps as a "fun" way of dealing with it) looking into The Legend of Spyro style copy-protection. This is where,…

I would suggest (perhaps as a "fun" way of dealing with it) looking into The Legend of Spyro style copy-protection. This is where, rather than just depending on the small activation component, there are small checks throughout your code that cause little inexplicable annoyances constantly if a pirated copy is found. Maybe people try to print things and 1/3 of the page is blank. Maybe they try to save files and there's a 1-in-100 chance of total corruption. Checks like these, when widely distributed through the code, obfuscated, and having different things they look for, can sometimes be a major PITA to fully detect and remove. If a pirate feels that getting an initial cracked copy is easy, but getting all the bugs out is miserable...

This sounds like a great way to make sure prospective customers think your software is buggy and awful and dissuade them from ever spending money on it.

Don't underestimate how often cracked software serves as educational tool or trial version for someone who will later be a professional with money who will buy legit licenses.

Re: Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

#12

Post by ChrisMarshallNY »

I’d suggest taking a page from Adobe and Microsoft.

They fight pirating, and that prevents it from becoming absolutely endemic, but they don’t really lose massive amounts of sleep over the cracks, because every cracked copy is training people to use their software.

Sort of “The Old Dope Peddler” model.

It’s not really correct to assume every cracked copy is a lost sale.

Instead, think of it as indoctrination of possible future sales.

Re: Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

#13

Post by grumpytiger »

gjsman-1000 wrote: post #7

> I'm not entirely sure what other information would be helpful to provide, but I was wondering if anyone has run into this into the past, and how it was mitigated. While we'll always have some piracy, we'd like to keep it to a minimum. I don't have answers but I have a few unusual ideas. I would suggest (perhaps as a "fun" way of dealing with it) looking into The Legend of Spyro style copy-protection. This is where,…

The risk for the first option is that your software will get the reputation of being glitchy

Re: Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

#14

Post by sjducb »

You say a license costs a few thousand dollars. Is that kind of customer going to use cracked pirated software? Are those customers going to risk a data breach to save a few thousand dollars? I don't think it'll affect your business at all.

If the cracked software gets downloaded a lot then maybe there's another mass market that will pay tens to hundreds of dollars for your software. If that happens then it might be worth releasing a new version of your product at a lower price point for those customers.

Re: Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

#15

Post by treebeard901 »

Way back in the day I was involved in cracking software that I needed to use and would share the keygens etc with other groups. Like many posts here say, I couldnt afford licenses.

It's an arms race and the best thing you can do is redesign your activation process. There are certain ways to do this that make it increasingly difficult to get around it.

It's like computer security in a way... You cant ultimately solve the problem but you can make it so difficult to do that the time investment required is probably not worthwhile for an attacker.

Re: Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

#16

Post by jsty »

If someone is sufficiently motivated, they'll always find ways to crack the software. If you don't have a large "personal" user base (as opposed to firms) - consider introducing a cut-price personal edition to lessen said motivation. Firms using it for "real work" - which I would hazard a guess at your price point form the bulk of revenue - are unlikely in any case to use a cracked or personal edition. Firms in less well-off regions may choose to buy the personal edition and accept the legal risk, but avoid the larger security risk of a cracked version - so you still get some revenue.

Re: Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

#17

Post by gjsman-1000 »

einr wrote: post #11
gjsman-1000 wrote: post #7

> I'm not entirely sure what other information would be helpful to provide, but I was wondering if anyone has run into this into the past, and how it was mitigated. While we'll always have some piracy, we'd like to keep it to a minimum. I don't have answers but I have a few unusual ideas. I would suggest (perhaps as a "fun" way of dealing with it) looking into The Legend of Spyro style copy-protection. This is where,…

I would suggest (perhaps as a "fun" way of dealing with it) looking into The Legend of Spyro style copy-protection. This is where, rather than just depending on the small activation component, there are small checks throughout your code that cause little inexplicable annoyances constantly if a pirated copy is found. Maybe people try to print things and 1/3 of the page is blank. Maybe they try to save files and there'…

I'd also suggest (sorry for forgetting) also having a student license program that is cheap or free upon proof of academic use, and other more-lenient ways of getting a legitimate copy if you are in such circumstances.

Re: Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

#18

Post by bitexploder »

ChrisMarshallNY wrote: post #12

I’d suggest taking a page from Adobe and Microsoft. They fight pirating, and that prevents it from becoming absolutely endemic, but they don’t really lose massive amounts of sleep over the cracks, because every cracked copy is training people to use their software. Sort of “The Old Dope Peddler” model. It’s not really correct to assume every cracked copy is a lost sale. Instead, think of it as indoctrination of possi…

Even be cheeky. Detect when the software is cracked (signature/binary hash changed) and message the user “we see your version is corrupt or cracked, you may want to reinstall. If you are using this software without paying for it ”. You can invest some time in obfuscation and more frequent releases, but I would not spend a lot of effort on it.

Re: Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

#19

Post by ballenf »

Double down efforts to survey users and potential users. Keep making the product better. Consider the pirate option as a competitor. Don’t demonize your user base, but don’t be afraid to go after any institution you know is using pirated version.

Build multiple telemetry code paths in your code — if you can just get IP addresses of offenders you’ll have way more info than now.

Re: Ask HN: We found a cracked version of our software on the web, now what?

#20

Post by SecurityMinded »

tlb wrote: post #8

You might consider offering more free or cheap versions, like a student edition (cheap with no proof required) and a free trial. Wolfram, for instance, does both. Not many real companies will cheat, and it's better to have users who can't pay using an official version than a cracked one. Perhaps they start using it in an un-funded skunkworks project, then buy a full license when the project gets funded.

This shows that you have never dealt with companies in 3rd world countries. When money is tight, which is always in those countries, there is not a cheap-enough price that you can make them pay. They want the benefit of the product but they do nit want to pay anything for it. So, a free trial version in those places, will turn into a perpetual "free" trial. Same for "no proof needed" student/academic versions. Unfortunately for the original poster, there is no solution to such a situation. Especially considering, they do nit want to spend an arm and a leg on legal enforcement, for a measly few thousand dollars worth of licensing fees. The only solution I can see for this kind of problem is to design the product to run purely online, leaving nothing more than a UI on the customers' hardware, but since the product is out, there is no way to put that cat back into the bag. May be they should consider future, enhanced versions of their software to run online only.
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